End of Prtalpha Introductory price..... Don't Panic!!!

[bob_lofthouse]

Hi everyone,

I’ve followed this forum nearly everyday for the last 18 months and this is the first time I have needed to post a question.

Firstly my company currently cuts approx 200 8’ x 4’ 12mm, 9mm and 6mm plywood panels into over 500 parts per week. We are currently cutting these by hand using jigsaws and routers. The web URL in my profile will give you more info.

The increase of shopbot prices in November has caused me to panic a little bit and, come to a purchasing decision.

Does the forum think that with the price increase would bring a further improvement in the tool? I would hate to think that I would miss out on an upgrade due to a couple of days. I’m aware that the shopbot is constantly being improved.

Also the majority of our parts require drilling; could anyone recommend or point me in the direction of a tool for drilling which could be attached to a 2nd Z axis. The 1st Z axis would use a 5hp spindle.

Any help or advice would be most appreciated.

Yours
Bob Lofthouse

[elcruisr]

Bob, I think the price increase is more because of the increase in steel prices, I don't think the machine is going to get any hardware changes. The software seems to be getting much of their attention and upgrading lately.

There was a really nice pneumatic cnc drill shown at the IWF show this year. Really small package and it seemed well thought out. There are several companies that offer electric drilling spindles that would fit a second z axis as well. I'd talk to the folks at Shopbot as they probably have experience with several of them as this should be a popular setup.

[cedarknight]

With that kind of volume, I can't believe you don't have a cnc router already. I am probably only averaging 6-8 4' x 8' sheet of different material a week. And our shopbot is earning its keep.

[bob_lofthouse]

Hi Bret ,

Our company only started in Jan 2003.

Our wood supplier currently cuts about 20% of our needs. They are not to keen on the idea of us purchasing a shopbot and call it a toy saying if its so good why aren’t there more in the UK?

We have 3 people working very hard cutting panels by hand but there are waste and quality issues.

In the UK cnc machines from new start at about $50k and for a used one which looks like it came out of the ark (and same size) you will look to pay about $30k.

I have to admit that I haven’t seen a PrtAlpha in the UK but I was hoping to travel to NJ to visit relatives and hopefully take a look at a PRT while I’m over.

Having read posts from Eric and other contributors I’m personally convinced it’s the machine for us.

I’ve just sent an email to shopbot enquiring about the router drill on the 2nd Z.

Yours Bob…

[harold_weber]

Robert,

Try asking ShopBot if there are any PRT or PRT-ALPHA owners in the UK that are willing to give a demo to you. Give them a few nearby counties that you would not mind driving to.

Regards,

Harold Weber

[cedarknight]

Robert,

It's not a toy, but it is a less expensive tool than most CNC's sold. But it will cut better then you can by hand and faster if you have some repetive parts. My comments were made when I seen the number of sheets you were cutting. We are making money with ours on a lot fewer sheets. So you know we are a sign shop and cut a lot of leters and shapes with ours. http://www.shopbottools.com/spotlight18.htm. You can spent a lot more and you can get a good machine. Maybe better, I don't know, only having a shopbot and nothing to compare too. I havn't even used ours to it full potential. And with the new Alpha, who know. Not like I am getting a commission on the sales of shopbot. But just letting you know my job is easier and the quality is improved.

Good Luck, Bret Spaulding

[rhfurniture]

Hi,
Could any of you brave folk who have upgraded their PRT to an Alpha tell me, IF speed was not an issue (I have a benchtop and havn't aproached max PRT speed yet), whether they would think the upgrade a good idea and why.

Ralph.

[billp]

It's a MUCH smoother machine in operation. The new control box will be a platform for a lot of new innovations. The actual gantry and carraiges are built better. From the carton to cutting would be a faster process since the machine is shipped partially assembled now. Just being able to JOG at high speeds is an incredible bonus.
I kept my PC router instead of upgrading to the spindle; ( still on the wish list though..), since much of what I have been cutting lately is foam, Trupan, etc. I still don't know the upper limits of cutting speeds but I've inched my way up to 7IPS in 3" thick foam with a 3IPS "Z"speed. I think I can go well beyond this too...
Once you see/hear an Alpha do a large, fast circle you get the entire picture..

[bob_lofthouse]

Hi all,

the bank has given us the okay today...

Having spoken to shopbot they have told me you can use a drilling router. Which still leaves me with a problem of which one.

Any suggestions would really be appreciated... we currently use 3.2mm Drill bits.

Shopbot also said that they were working on a specific tool for the job.

[gerald_d]

A 3.2mm drill working in wood is very light work and it wants to spin really fast. I would use a standard 1/4" (6mm) router or pencil grinder or die grinder with a slim body and no gearbox.

[Brady Watson]

Robert,
You CAN use a standard router to do the drilling for you with an 1/8" collet. 3.2mm = 0.125984252 inches. While the router's bearings are not really designed to do drilling, you can use it to get you up and running quickly. This is of course not to say that the router is going to let you down any time soon. You may also want to find another brand router instead of the Porter Cable which is prone to premature bearing failure. I recommend the Makita because it is quieter than the PC. With a 1/8" collet you will have the choice of running 3.2mm, .125" router bits OR drill bits. Just run it at the lowest RPM to avoid burning if this is an issue. Drill bits are really not recommended (technically) because they are not speed rated above 6,000 RPM.

While the machine is drilling all of the holes that you'd normally spend time on...you can design a mount and research the right tool for the job


-Brady

[paco]

Is this Makita model (which is?) fit the provide SB holder for 7518 PC?
Anyboby use/considered/experienced the Milwaukee 5625-20? I've been informed that it fit readilly the SB holder...?

[gerald_d]

"While the router's bearings are not really designed to do drilling"

Router bearings are typically deep-groove ball bearings, which are designed for a moderate amount of thrust load. Drilling 3.2mm holes is a much lower load on the bearing than the usual sideways load of a 6mm router bit going 30mm/s 6mm deep.

[bob_lofthouse]

Good news,

Our money is being wired as we speak to shopbot... I'm told the money will take 2/3 days to arrive in shopbots account. (£45.00 in fees)

Our info from customs and excise is that we will face import duty of 1.7%

We've ordered the 10ft x 5ft alpha with 3hp spindle. A second Z with a porter cable, probe, zero plate etc and 15hp vacuum hold-down system.

The only two things that worry me are the drilling with the porter cable and the fact that the guy I expect to run the machine said today "will I get to go on a course?"

I look forward to asking you all many questions and sharing our experiences.

yours Robert

[paco]

Congratulations Robert!!
You choose a quite "complete combo"! Well equiped! I believe you should'nt worry about drilling with the PC... unless you plan to drill with a 1" hole with a 1"bit 1" deep at 2"/sec. and up!!!
I would more be worried about your "futur operator" attitude/confidence... SB can provide a training I think... but the tool is quite simple (nothing regarding it's possibility!!!...)... keep looking and searching the forum (or suggest your "futur operator"...), you'll find MANY answers and GREAT correspondants!!

[Paul Amos (Unregistered Guest)]

Good Luck

What rate did the bank give you for the $ exchange ?

Regards

Paul

[bob_lofthouse]

Hi Paul,

Our exchange rate was just over $1.83 to the pound.... I was pleased to see it wasn't the tourist rates.

Paco ........ I think my guy was hoping for a free trip to north carolina...

all the best ..... Rob

[bob_lofthouse]

Well looking at the new prices it looks like I've saved $2000 by purchasing before the 14th.

Also interesting to note that they have removed the pricing info on the 3HP Colombo.

I can't wait to take delivery now..

[mnrite@yahoo.com]

The new price sheet does not have any Vacuum options , anyone know why?

Thanks
Mike

[bob_lofthouse]

I'm very excited as my shopbot arrives in the UK tomorrow.

I can't wait....

[hespj]

Robert, mine arrives end of month (I hope). Exiting.
I must say, I'm a bit apprehensive too. I'd be interested to know if any problems crop up re delivery and installation.

John

[mikejohn]

Robert and John
Add me to the list of what happens with customs please.
Mine arrives early March
...Mike

[bob_lofthouse]

Hi all,

As soon as I have more info I will let you know what happens and how I go on at the UK end.

I know that we will have to pay our duty and vat by bank draft or credit transfer as credit cards are not accepted.

I have already invited Neil Brewer who will use his machine for the same applications as myself to pay a visit.

[bob_lofthouse]

Well my shopbot has arrived.

No problems getting it passed customs.

DHL handled everything. when the HGV arrived we gave the driver a bankers draft for payment of VAT and Import Duty.

You will definately need a forklift truck to get it off the HGV.

We seem to have a couple of components missing but Shopbot have been informed by email and I'm sure it will be sorted out sooner rather than later.

We've started putting the table together and I have to say that the pictures of the table on the shopbot website don't do it any justice. The table is very very substantial and strong.

The manual supplied is very large but the step by step instructions are very easy to follow.

I do have a couple of questions which I'll post later, elsewhere.

[bob_lofthouse]

Hi Everyone,

I'd thought I'd put a few pictures up on our website so that you can see how were going on putting up our shopbot.

http://www.plylineuk.co.uk/shopbot/shopbot.htm

[hespj]

Thanks Robert. That's quite a setup. Is that an 8x4 table? Looks bigger.

[bob_lofthouse]

Hi John,

We've got a 10x5 table.

I've posted a few more pics of the control box which is to be wired up to the mains sooner rather than later I hope.

[bob_lofthouse]

Hi everyone,

Well I've cut the Vacuum board and Wow!!! It is absolutely brilliant.

The Columbo is soooooo Quiet (compared to the PC)

The only problem we've had is an error message during the cutting of the bed saying a limit switch has been activated, even though the machine was not near the switches/bolts.

The cutting file resumed after pressing resume and towards the end of the file the stops became more frequent.

We've put this down to electrical noise and we intend to put in some more grounds and move some of the cables around.

If anyone has encountered a similar problem their advice would be appreciated.

But I'll say it again Wow!!! It is absolutely brilliant.

Many thanks to the Shopbot team have been so supportive.

Yours Rob

[fleinbach]

Robert,
This is the exact problem I was having with my Alphaprt120 since I installed it last August. That was up until about two months ago. I had tried many things like checking out all my ground connections and adding them wherever they were needed. But as you say the problem was intermittent. Some files would run without a problem while others would stop several times. This symptom was always that the limit light would come on. For some reason it seemed that if a file was prone to have the problem it could be repeated running that file. Strangely it didn't always stop at exactly the same spot. And being intermittent occasionally you couldn't produce it again running the same file.

Then I finally ran a file that would stop numerous times every time you ran the file. That's when I e-mailed Ted and he suggested to check my 3hp spindle for grounding. Actually we had discussed this months earlier but determined that it was grounded properly. Normal grounding for the 3hp Colombo spindle is to connect the shielded drain wire at the controller but not at the motor. Even though this is the suggested method for grounding Ted said that occasionally grounding the other end also would help this problem. So I grounded the end at the spindle motor and ran the problem file several times without a stop. I removed the ground connection I had just made and tried running the file again. It stopped repeatedly. I reconnected the ground wire and a file ran without a hitch. That was two months ago and I haven't had the problem occur since.

[bob_lofthouse]

Hi Frank,

Thanks for the reply. I've had a quick chat with shopbot and it seems that it is the same problem.

I've run the Porter Cable(pc) without any problems.

Now then it's back to the fun job of plumbing in the Vacuum bed!!!

All the best Rob

[bob_lofthouse]

Well I've gone and done it now...

I've just got my bank to send shopbot some money for my second machine.

This time I'm getting a prtalpha96 with 5hp spindle, air drill and an extra Y motor to beef it up.

We are also retro-fitting an extra y motor to our 10 x 5 machine.