FlexCabs: the saga continues

[daski]

I feel that Patrick should have every opportunity to answer for himself and would ask that he do so here for all of us. I was really a believer in the software. I have been very patient in waiting for this sofware to be developed. I like to see constant communication and weekly updates in the software. Activity with regards to the software development seems to have stopped. As of today we do not have what was promised.

Therefore please be advised that for the following reasons;
1. Inactivity on your behalf with regards to the development of the promised software,
2. No communication or updates for the last few weeks
3. No functioning software
4. A sales site that is still operating

I will commence a police investigation into your activities.

Should you wish to prevent this action you must contact, and speak with me by phone at 613-290-2237 before August 4th at 5:00 pm EDT.


Thank you

Dave Skinner

[bill_lumley]

Thanks Dave for taking this action . It is improtant for future efforts of this kind (hardware or software) that people understand the commitments they are making and what is expected of them when they enter the vendor arena . I have taken the action of informing my credit card company of the fraud that has transpired and they have recovered my funds subject to a 45 day waiting period where Patrick can respond to prove us all wrong on his intentions as demonstrated of late .

Thanks to another botter for the suggestion of using the credit card company's to report the fraud as they take immediate action that none of us can do on our own .

Bill

[dray]

Why doesnt someone just google him and give him a call?

He may just be busy

Send me the # I'll do it

[bill_lumley]

Danny , Dave has done that already . He called every Toomey in Kissimee and could not locate him . The number he publishes on his website is no longer answered .

I must admit I scratch my head why many folks on this forum want to give this guy a break 'cause it's hard' !! You don't ask money for something , not deliver and then stop communicating and then ask for forgiveness . The only excuse we who paid for this are willing to accept is that he is in hospital but even then he should have a friend who can communicate with his users .

I started this thread for the reason that he turned off his forum and his answering machine in the same day and has not been heard from since . Surely it is not up to his customers to 'find' him . He has been reported to the police and the internet fraud investigators ... enough said .

[henrik_o]

I know I shouldn't stick my nose where it doesn't belong, but at what stage was the development when the author went AWOL?

If there was actually something working, and if restitution of funds is not possible, a wild idea would be to explore whether those possibly defrauded could demand ownership of the code base, in that case at least something might be salvaged.

I'll shut up now.

[cookie]

What bothers me the most is that his website is up and he is still coaxing more people to buy and no intention of delivering a product. Now thats BAD.

[richards]

I agree with Henrik. Those who've paid 'advance' money should have first rights to the source code. But, if several of you gain ownership of the source code, what will you do then? If anyone of you is capable of writing code that does what Patrick promised you, why would you have sent money to Patrick in the first place? Would that transfer of ownership include a non-compete clause to prohibit Patrick from offering a completed version of the software if and when he ever delivers a product? What kind of a judge would allow that?

Is the court system in Patrick's area willing to spend tens of thousands of dollars to pursue the case? Even up here in Utah where most homes still cost less than $500,000, and most households still make less than $75,000 a year, a little case like this would never make it to court. Prosecutors cost money. Investigation costs money. Judges and courts cost money. Somewhere there has to be a pile of money sitting around to be confiscated to pay the bills of all the legal eagles before 'justice' will be pursued.

How about doing the noble thing and just let it go?

[jseiler]

noble-Having or showing qualities of high moral character, such as courage, generosity, or honor

I like how the character of the people who got screwed is what's being questioned here. Weak.

John

[myxpykalix]

I've stayed out of this because "I don't have a dog in this fight" (unlike Micheal Vick), and don't have a need to make cabinets but I found this link somewhere (maybe here) and someone who has an interest to follow it up. It sounds like free lance code writers. Maybe they can take what you have and run with it, i have no clue. But i thought it might help:
http://www.rentacoder.com/RentACoder/default.asp
I'll leave you with this: Novus Ordo Seclorum

[cjohnson]

How many of us "investors" are out there? 10, 50, 150? At 299.00 a pop, that's a lot of money there. I wonder when a missed due date becomes fraud or does it ever? Any lawyer turned shopbotters out there? Fraud is kinda interesting. What a lot of criminals don't know is that the corporate "veil" does not protect principals or officers of a company when fraud is proven. All in all, I hope that the software is developed and everyone can be satisfied. I guess only time will tell.

[thewoodcrafter]

CJ,
I think Flexcabs is a done deal.

In the surveys Patrick did for machines types there was at most 17 responses. A nice chunk of change but hardly anything to retire with.

I don't think it started off as fraud. I think Patrick just bit off more than he could chew, got overwhelmed and bailed when he figured out he was not half way done yet. I would like to think his intentions started out as honorable and sincere.

and -
WE STILL NEED SOFTWARE FOR CABINETS!!!

[pfulghum]

I personally like BoxCutter, I'm the author


http://www.users.qwest.net/~pfulghum/

or

http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/show.cgi?tpc=31&post=32421#POST32421

Give the trial a whirl...
If you like it...drop me an email and we will talk $$.... Guaranteed to be MUCH cheaper than $299.

-- pat

[woodgod]

I have read most if not all of the posts on this subject. I am a new botter and was extremely interested in flex cabs. I even talked to patrick on several occasions before he dropped off of the face of the earth. I wanted so bad for him to be able to pull it off,BUT, I have been in the cabinet business long enough to understand the task he undertook. Not because I know anything about writing software,Ryan,Frank and others at shopbot will attest to that! but because all other nesting software that I looked at was $5000.00 or more. On that bases alone I was leary of patrick's chances of success at the price he was quoting so I didnt jump in. I guess what I am trying to find a diplomatic way of saying is those who jumped in must have realized that at the very least they were getting somthing for nothing. When I find myself in this position I just lick my wounds and get back to work and replace what I lost on a risky venture. I can make $299.00 in about 1 hour. I hope my opinion doesnt prevent me from getting my questions answered on this forum in the future but there is a principle in consumer law known as "caveate emptor" or buyer be aware. If you are going to succeed in business learn it well!

[mgcain]

I agree with you James, that writing everything from scratch is a daunting task, and not for the meek. I have been writing commercial software for over 25 years and early on we learned the value of "outsourcing" - or buying components that are already done and in the market, such as the nesting engine used by Flexcabs.

I posted on this thread that in mid-August, I would pick up where I left off, working on a program to replace what Patrick was doing with FlexCabs and build on it. I looked at the flexcabs product and licensed a lot of those same re-usable parts.

I am in the process of getting the program ready and up on the web for you guys to start kicking the tires on, along with a public forum for input. I'm still 30-45 days away from the starting point, which will be free for a limited time - nobody will risk any more investment.

The starting point for a feature set will be what Flexcabs supported in its last release. It will need a lot more work before its "commercial ready", but I want to get this minimal configuration up and running so you all can start playing with it and provide your input.

I will post the forum address and the web-site up here in a week or so, as soon as I have it in a somewhat showable form. From that point forward, regular "progress updates" will be available on the forum.

-BTW - I have at least one valued Advisor who posted on this thread and I wouldn't be where I am without his help. I will welcome any others and you can email me offline of the forum.

[thewoodcrafter]

Danny,
The program was never finished. It ended up not very useful. Still needed more development and the library was incomplete.
Keep a watch out for Mitch Cain's program. It just might be what you've been looking for.