wholesale picing

[Big-Tex]

I hope not to start thread that will start hot discussion, but I need help.
My having a router was to intended to go back in business and do not work for
someone to rest of my life and believe me I hate every minute of it working for a..holes I work for, unfortunately I don't have much choice for now.

I am actively seeking as much as possible whole sale accounts to grow list of clients that will help me achieve my set goal.

I have job for sign shop and do not know that would be fair price for cutting
12" letters "Behind The Wheel" out of 1/2 Sintra & Brushed Aluminum, customer provides material. Thank you guys for all of your help so far I have leaned from you a lot.

[steve fedor]

This site may be a helpfull.

http://www.thesignexpert.com/TheSignExpert.com/Sign_Business_Help_and_Resources.html

[joe]

We often look at www.geminisignletters.com (http://www.geminisignletters.com). Their wholesale price is 40% off the catalogue price. You'd reduce off the cost of the customers materials to get a final price.

[Big-Tex]

We often look at www.geminisignletters.com (http://www.geminisignletters.com). Their wholesale price is 40% off the catalogue price. You'd reduce off the cost of the customers materials to get a final price.


That is quite fair to both parties. I will see it that flies if not I got cheap client on hand. :)

thx

[Big-Tex]

Thank you all for contribution....

Here it is new account and material I have not done before, I guess we all never
stop learning....


http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e333/carhaus/0826231432.jpg

[signtist]

I just made some of those wholesale for another sign shop.
5" Times Roman 1/2" PVC w/ brushed aluminum face.....$18 ea.

John wwwsigngraphics1@aol.com
What did you charge????

[joe]

John,

How many letters in that order?

Joe

[signtist]

10 condensed letters ( about 6"x30"of material )Joe.....I never throw the small scraps out. This is the reason.
When I need to buy more material, I feel justified.

[Big-Tex]

I charged $15 a letter nominal size 12" and customer provided 1" foam with aluminum facing and eps file. In the process he added some more work extra for additional $$$. All took 3/4 of 4x4 sheet. All was nested without rotation to maintain brushing grain in one direction,

[joe]

Gemini's pricing for Laminate letters ( 12" plastic with brushed aluminum ) goes for $42.00 retail. You can knock off $10 for wholesale.

That seems about right but a little on the low side.

Most of the letters we sell are made from Extira. No finish, no fixtures, no nothing other than the materials cut to specs. 12" wholesale for $38.50 with a minimum order of $250.

Because you have a router doesn't mean you reduce your prices. I feel so sorry for most sb'ers because they have little or no knowledge of pricing. And it seems most are pricing themselves way too low.

Last week we cut 22@ 9.75" from .75 extira, then followed it up with the same letters cut from DiBond sprayed with a PMS autobody finish. It finished out for $820.00. The work took the better part of a day which makes marginal in profit.

[Big-Tex]

Maybe it is on low side, I want this guy to get to trust me and hooked I will rise prices little by little. It may not sound fair but once I get established I can dictate price. I do not have ell established business like you Joe.

My uncle said when you look for customer they dictate price but when they are looking for you than you have upper hand. Aint that a truth.

[Big-Tex]

For me its a foot in the door. Also opportunity to get more experiance with various materials without me buying material.

[Gary Campbell]

Thomas...
I believe you have just set the price for your work. As stated above, possibly low.

If the person you are dealing with is an astute business man, he has already "hooked" you as the "low price guy". When you attempt to raise prices you will lose his trust in a heartbeat. And his work.

It takes years, high demand and a strong reputation to be able to "dictate" wholesale prices. There are many internet suppliers out there that generate high volume wholesale products. Sell your product as local, quick turnaround, no frieght.... etc at the same price as Gemini. And then make sure the customer has no reason to ever go to Gemini or any of the online sellers again.

[bleeth]

You just heard it from a couple of guys who learned it the hard way. Here it is from another. This client knows exactly what they cost to have them produced by Gemini. No sign professional doesn't. If his only reason to get them from you is to beat price then the moment you don't he is gone. If want he wants is a non-gemini standard font or size or finish then they will still do them but the price is higher. You need to get Gemini's price for the exact product and let him know, even if it's only a buck a letter difference, that you set your prices and not him.

[joe]

Thomas,

I'd like to complement you on your effort to start up a business.

I'm with the previous fellows post pricing your work low with the intent of raising your prices is a flawed theory. I've seen it fail for years. You diserve a fair price. Search retail catalogues offering CNC work and you'll have a better idea of proper prices. Don't go below their prices! They've done the research.

[joewino]

You can always go down on your pricing, but it is extremely difficult to go up.

Once you have established yourself as the "cheap guy" you will always have that reputation, even if you raise your prices.

Your idea sounds right, but it doesn't work.

You will not get all the work in town, but you will get the best if you price your work correctly and deliver quality with every product.

Joe Crumley did not get where he is today by starting off cheap and then raising his prices. He's probably always been one of the more expensive shops in town. Most of the ones who have been around for a long time are. The cheap ones don't last very long, because there is always someone willing to do it a little cheaper. It's a downward spiral.

[kevin]

Thomas its going to be a hard battle. I believe to stay in business or start up as a 1 man shop, you have to market yourself as an artist and have something nobody else has. People always pay money for different. That is Joe's success. In my case, I do high-end cabinetery. I am about the only one within an hour's drive. I am at a point now, that I can dictate my price and they, the customers, don't have anywhere else to go but for an $8,000.00 kitchen, I can open up the yellow pages and give you 20 names. I think what it will come down to is how dedicated you are to your chosen craft and how much time to pursue excellence. You are on the right track. How many guys have a CNC? I am not giving out advice. Just my thoughts.

[Big-Tex]

Thank you gentleman.

Point made. I do strive for quality work and do not want to under cut pricing.
That is part of learning curve.

I am fortunate to have great help like you.

[Big-Tex]

I have been doing my homework and checking competition.
Here is retail price list of a company that is local.
http://yoursignchoice.com/files/Dimensional_Letters_Catalog.pdf

What do you think about those figures?

[clueless]

What do you think about those figures?

I won't comment on too high or too low, but I'll throw some figures back at you.

For metal laminated acrylic, 1/4" thick, they want $26.02 for a 8" tall letter.

Gemini will sell it for $10.98 for that same letter with many more finish options.

[mklafehn]

Tom,

Nice job on the letters.

What bit did you use for these? Been wanting to try some metallic faced letters, but have ? about how to glue the substrates together and if they glue will gum up the bit after just a couple of letters.

[Big-Tex]

1" Gator foam wit aluminum lay up, purchased at Allied plastics.
This one is brushed so you can nest with rotation set to 180 deg only or 360.

[Big-Tex]

More letters I did this weekend.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e333/carhaus/0916232734.jpg

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e333/carhaus/0918181533.jpg

This one I did while back with some inspiration of shopboters.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e333/carhaus/0209131712-1.jpg

[joewino]

Thomas - the "S" is upside down.

[ken_rychlik]

That made me spit out my coffee Raymond.:)

[Big-Tex]

Raymond I realize that.

[joewino]

Thomas...so, why didn't you turn it around:)

[joe]

That's OK Thomas. Sometimes when Raymond misses his afternoon nap he gets grumpy. I don't know how many times I've neglected using the spell checker and catches a typo. That's an opne invite for him to accosts me. Sometimes he looses the direction of the topic.


By the way, when are you going to visit our shop with some of your samples?


Joe Crumley
www.normansignco.com (http://www.normansignco.com)

[joewino]

I've got my eye on you too, Crumley. So...watch it.

[scootie]

For anyone using the OpenOffice Suite from Sun Systems (its a free download, just Google "Open Office" for it) I have developed a spreadsheet estimating form. It's free to anyone that wants to use it, it should import into MS Excel? Try it, I don't use Excel as OpenOffice does everything I occasionally need for spreadsheets. Anyway, I created this one for estimating the cost for cutting letters in PVC.

It's easy to use and adapt to your own price ranges.
The light yellow cells are for plugging in your materials and known labor prices. You can change these on the fly as prices change.
The light orange cells are for sizes or number of labor steps or number of linear inches to cut. If you use CorelDraw there is a macro plugin that allows you to measure the linear path length of a bunch of letters. Look on Macro Monster, it's also a free download.
At the bottom column of light green cells, there is a light orange cell for putting in your mark-up %.
It totals as you go and gives an accurate way to estimate. It depends on your ability to put in the correct parameters for materials and your labor cost, the download is set with my costs and shop rates of apr. $65 per hour. The spreadsheet file is posted on my website, the forum does not support the file extension of .ODS for spreadsheets.
www.elliott-design.net/PVC-letters.htm (http://www.elliott-design.net/PVC-letters.htm)

[Big-Tex]

I tested new new features (texturing) with my CADCaM and here is what I came up with. Copy is little high as this only a test.

I will use this in my upcoming project. I do need to test on scrap splitting since panel is twice as big as my router and do not want to mess up nice panel.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e333/carhaus/0927190704.jpg