fresh eye

[chunkstyle]

Hello all,

I've been asked to bid on a sign job of sorts. Customer wants their Logo to be cut out and mounted in the reception room wall of their offices. Logo consists of a couple of words, a swoopy line and a red dot. Type font looks similar to ariel.

Never having done this, I thought it might be a good idea to outline my strategy to do this potential job and get a second opinion.

Cut out the letters from HDU.
Using a 1/8" diam., 3 flute down cut bit from Precision Bits to cut out the shapes.
Ditto on the swoopy line and red dot shape.

Use client supplied vector art work for the shapes and cut a mounting template as well.

Use coroplast for the mounting template.

At site:
Mount coroplast template to wall. Attach with tape.
Install the shapes onto the wall using silicone and tape.
Wait 30 minutes to remove tape and template.
Collect fat check from client : )

Never worked with HDU before. I've just recieved a sample from a supplier. There are three samples from SF and have 10,15,18 graded pieces.
I'm thinking that the 18 would be best as it looks the most dense.

Any advice for finishing the cut shapes cut out of this material would be greatly appreciated. Also, any advice or criticism of my plan of execution would be great.

Thanks in advance,
Tim

[dakers]

you can use any substrate if you can communicate to the client the pros and cons of each and let them decide.
hdu, plex, pvc, mdo, medex, styrofoam, gatorboard, etc all have a different look and quality.

If the customer is very picky about things being perfect we prefer to sell the lobby displays that have the nicest edges which is plex that is cut on water jet. Although we have done alot with metal finish ultraboard and pvc as well if they like what ultraboard does for them as it is available with so many nice metal finishes.

we explain about the gloss vs matte finishes and install techniques (flush or stand offs)
the customer has never chosen mdo so far because of the edges. We can coat the edges but that is more labor.
it is so subjective.

I like pvc, ultraboard, plex especially if we can get the right color and do not have to paint it.

[chunkstyle]

Thanks Dick,

I'll look into the pvc, ultra board or plex. The letters are going to stay white as well as the swoop graphic. The only thing that will have color is the red dot.
The client does not know how thick he wants to have the letters. If the size of this is large then I would assume that it would look better if the letters were thicker. IF that turns out to be the case then I may have to double up on a material if I can't get it thick enough to begin with.

Clients wants the graphic semi subtle so white and stuck directly to the wall was his thinking.

Thanks for the help,
Tim

[dakers]

http://www.chemetalco.com/
this is somewhat unrelated but we are considering these products for a lobby display

[Mayo]

Be careful using tape on painted walls. Especially commercially painted interiors - sometimes drywall isn't primed and they shoot paint right over the dust. When you go to remove your tape, you'll pull off the paint with it. Then you're responsible for repainting the whole wall because a touch up is gonna show!

If you double up your material to get a thicker letter, and the install is within 10 or 15 feet of the line of vision it will be noticed.

HDU cuts like butter however the surface finish will have a somewhat textured look because of the nature of the foam.
Primer can level it somewhat but you will have extra labor in finishing.
HDU tends to retain the dust from cutting. Brushing it off isn't as effective as using an air hose.
The best way is to rinse off with a hose or under a faucet. This eliminates the static charge.

If painted with a glossy paint, it will accent every little defect.
If possible use flat or eggshell rather than glossy. If you've never finished letters before, and the client wants white, go with a material that comes white and save the steps of finishing.

[joe]

Tim,

Did you get the bid?

Like Dick, I'd try to use PVC. That eleminates painting and the material is half the price as HDU. It's also tough as a boot. This job looks like quick EZ money.

Joe

[chunkstyle]

Hi Joe,

I submitted a bid today after checking out the cost of PVC sheet stock. Thanks for the suggestions from everyone. Don't know if I will get it or not. I was doing alot of guesstimates for the labor, machine time, etc...
Hopefully you'll hear from me soon, asking about tooling advice for cutting PVC : ) (I'll check the older posts first, though)

Tim

[toych]

Tim, PVC is a breeze to cut, search the forum and give it a try. If you have any issues post here and you will get lots of help I'm sure.

[chunkstyle]

Hi All,

I have going back and forth with the client on his logotype. Client is kinda high maintenance and has taken awhile to get a decision made on the particulars (required calls and pictures of similar graphic application from their HQ in Germany). Finally getting close to locking in the scale of the logotype.
Expanded PVC is acceptable but the logotype has a red dot that will scale about 6" in diameter.

My question is how to handle the red dot. It has been suggested to me by a plastics dealer to use a 3" ABS material to machine it out of and paint it red. Claimed it machines very well. Has anyone had any experience with ABS and would you recommend it or any other material?

It looks like I don't have the required skills to tool path a semi-sphere. I've created a bit mapped circle with a greyscale and thought maybe Photo Vcarve. Saw a tip on the Vetric forum using gray scale to set the high's and low's of a shape. Does anyone have experience with using this technique? If so, would it be a workable solution to getting this hemisphere tool pathed?

Thanks for any insights,
Tim

[joe]

I'd consider cutting the red eye from clear plex and spray the back with Fusion paint. This results in a very high gloss surface and gives extra depth.

Can't imagine you're having a problems with an area clear on the half round oval. Perhaps you don't have a graphics program to make the oval.

Joe

[chunkstyle]

Hi Joe,

I'll try and describe what the client is requesting a little better.
For this red dot: picture a globe of the world and cut off about a third of it on your bandsaw. The smaller third peice is the shape that would make the red dot. Client is finding out how thick Corporates' dot is and wants same on their wall.

I can make a circle in Photoshop and create an even grey scale where the center of the circle could be white and the outer edge could be black.
I don't own PhotoVcarve but I thought that it could assign heights of a bitmap image by their gray scale value. Thus the middle white could be the highest and the outer black of the circle could be the lowest height?

This is one thought to skin this shape. I was wondering if it was the best/easiest way to do it. I currently only have Partworks.

Thanks for your advice, it's very helpful to a newbie such as myself.

Tim

[beacon14]

I think there is a way to do a simple shape like that using the Extruder tool built into the SB control software. Bill Y might be able to point you in the right direction.

[joe]

Sure WOOD like to see that happen.

[chunkstyle]

Thanks David & Joe,

I'll look into the extruder tool and start searching the posts for any info.

"WOOD"......duh! Talk about tunnel vision! Thanks Joe.

[chunkstyle]

Hi all,

This has been a slooow crawl to a client decision but I'm now asked if he can get two logotypes cut out. One for inside and one for outside mounted to the side of his building.

My question is can expanded PVC be used for an exterior application? Thought I'd post here with the experienced fabricators rather than suppliers.

Thanks
Tim

[steve_g]

Tim:

My experience with expanded PVC such as Sintra has not been good in exterior applications. The colors will fade so painting is a must; also unsupported elements will sag over time.

I admit my exterior experience has been minimal, and I would like to see what some of the “old salts” have to say.

Steve

[chunkstyle]

Well it looks like my nibble has turned into a catch! Client finally committed to the project and I now have to make it. Would anyone have a suggestion for the type of router bit and rpm, feed speeds that will leave a good quality edge on expanded PVC.

This client is a repeat and, like all other projects I've done for him, he stalls and ruminates right up until the last minute of his schedule to give the green light. I'll be getting the sheet stock on Monday from a local supplier but it would really help if someone could direct me to a proven router bit. Guy wants it yesterday. Typical...

Thanks for any advice.
Tim

[chunkstyle]

Thought I'd post the final result. Thanks for all the help and advice on construction and material selection. Wound up using the white PVC. Client like the photo of the first one I sent for final approval and wound up ordering a second. Finished installing this afternoon. Did have some trouble with the paint in the first room. Glad for the heads up. This was a lot of fun and hope to find more of this work. Nice break from the cabinets.
Thanks for the help and advice. Very much appreciated,
Tim

[steve_g]

Very nice!

[wmcghee]

WOW, that looks really nice. How did you end up doing the circle? Can you explain the installation process ? thanks for sharing.

[chunkstyle]

Thanks Guys,

The red dot was made out of MDF mounted on the 1/2" PVC. The convex surface shape was made in TurboCad. Saved the shape as an STL. and tool pathed it in Cut 3-D. Artwork was scaled in Adobe Illustrator, saved off as a DXF. Brought in to Partworks and tool pathed.

We cut the same file again for the coroplast mounting template. Instead of cutting on the outside of the artwork it was cut on the inside with a -.03" offset leaving a negative space with some wiggle room around the PVC letters.

Mounted template to the wall with tape. Applied silicone to the backs of the letters and spot glued some hot glue. Stuck the letters thru the template and onto the wall. Held the letters long enough for the hot melt to cool and bond.
Lot's of fun.

[joe]

Excellent work my friend.

Don't be concerned about using PVC outdoors. The only limit, use only the white material. Attached is a 3/4" PVC sign which is ten years old with V routed letters. The paint is latex. I've never seen this heavy weight materials warp or sag. I believe it will outlast just about thing on the market. Easy to paint too.

Keep up the good work.

Joe