sandblasted sample

[bobmoore]

I have a sign company that wants a sample of a somewhat rustic wood sign with a sandblasted background. I have read past posts for the last couple days and think I have a plan. I have laminated and planed 2 yellow pine 2 x 6's with yellow glue for the sample (will use west epoxy for the real sign). My plan is to mask the border with 3 layers of blue painters tape, mill the background .125 deep, mask the letters area, mill another .125, sandblast the background, machine .125 letters seperately, paint the letters and border, glue the letters to the .125 raised area. Finally spray the entire sign with spar varnish 4 coats. Any comments are certainly welcome. Bob

[bobmoore]

Since I am kind of new to this I was hoping for a little feedback on my plan from some sign guys/gals.
Thanks Bob

[joe]

Bob,

I wish you luck.

Since you've never blasted, I'd suggest you start with a raw piece of wood and see how it goes. That by itself is a lesson. Knowing the proper way to cut SB mask and choosing the blast media is a lesson to be learned first.

For every one person who tries sandblasting there are a thousand who give up after the first try or two. It's really, really, really tough to pull it off. My first hint is, you need a compressor that produces a minimum 120 CFM. PSI isn't important. Remember, you're working with vertical grain only.

There's nothing like wading in waste deep for the a lesson.

Joe Crumley
www.normansignco.com

[letterman7]

You're going to machine 1/8" letters? Or 1/8 thick? How big is this sample? It would be worth your while to find a sign shop near you to cut your sample in the appropriate sandblast mask, then you can apply it to the wood. Like Joe says, it's a lesson learned. Trying to mill, mask, blast, mill and repeat is simply wasting time. It isn't rocket science to blast with the appropriate equipment and media (I used screened play sand for years) and on pine won't take very long to get to your target depth. And Joe is also correct on the compressor requirements. It's all about the CFM - you have to be able to keep a constant pressure on the hopper or you'll blast for a few seconds and wait for the compressor to catch up and repeat. Frustrating..

[joe]

Rick,

He's wanting to blast Yellow Pine. That's one of the hardest woods on the planet to sandblast. Makes little difference though. He's in the learning process and needs to go through it.

Joe

[bobmoore]

Thanks for the input Joe. Just knowing it is going to be frustrating and which processes will helps avoid frustration. I am guessing from your post that 50-60 psi is a good start point and I watch the progress as I blast?
Rich sorry I was unclear. The sample is approximately 34 x 10 x 1.25 thick after planing. The letters are 4 in tall and .125 thick. The word will simply say "SAMPLE".
Bob

[jerry_stanek]

Has anyone tried sand blasting with a pressure washer I have the sand injector for my Simpson pressure washer and I am thinking of giving it a try.

[joe]

Jerry,

It's a standard, of the trade, used in cleaning. Not good for signs.

Jees, one of our good friend said I was becoming a Sign Mensh. I tell ya there's no respect from these young CNC hoodulums.


Joe Crumley
www.normansignco.com

[letterman7]

Has anyone tried sand blasting with a pressure washer I have the sand injector for my Simpson pressure washer and I am thinking of giving it a try.

Won't work for sandblasting, but works great for aging wood posts!

[beacon14]

Hey Joe, that would be Sign Mench (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=mench), it's Yiddish. At least I hope that's the meaning he intended, some of the alternate meanings are a little out there.

[J Colvin]

I have a sign company that wants a sample of a somewhat rustic wood sign with a sandblasted background. I have read past posts for the last couple days and think I have a plan. I have laminated and planed 2 yellow pine 2 x 6's with yellow glue for the sample (will use west epoxy for the real sign). My plan is to mask the border with 3 layers of blue painters tape, mill the background .125 deep, mask the letters area, mill another .125, sandblast the background, machine .125 letters seperately, paint the letters and border, glue the letters to the .125 raised area. Finally spray the entire sign with spar varnish 4 coats. Any comments are certainly welcome. Bob

Hi Bob
I'm a signmaker in Ontario, The best material to use is HDU (signfoam) I made a 4' x6' x 2" thick sign using a 3deg .125 ball that comes in the starter kit. I also v-carved letters into it.I used the texturing program to simulate a sandblasted background. the sign is one peice(no where for water to get in). it will not warp, rot , crack even in our harsh winters. Fully painted with signmakers one-shot and vu coated. This sign will last for a very long time. Sorry I'm new to this forum and can't seem to post pictures. Email me at jamiecolvin@xplornet.com and I will send you them.
regards
Jamie

[J Colvin]

Here are a few pics of the sign I was talking about in the previous post
Jamie

[bobmoore]

Thanks James. That is a good looking sign but the customer specifically asked for wood so I am trying to work through that. The HDU samples I have come in 10, 15, and 20 lb. weights. What is you favorite and have you seen the splitting problems reported here on the forum in Ontario?
Bob

[joe]

I'm so glad to see so many posts on the topic of Sandblasting.

A few years ago this topic wouldn't even be appropriate. After all this is a router forum and sandblasting wasn't on the menu.

One little finishing hint: I leave an outline for all my lettering. That not only adds interest but it also allows for little mistakes.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e115/jcrumley1/PleasantOaksCopyClose-Up.jpg

James,

Congratulations on the excellent sign. Your technique is top notch. I look forward to seeing more of your creative work. The background texture is one of the best I've seen. Where can I get a copy of it.


Joe Crumley
www.normansignco.com

[bobmoore]

Joe;
I am looking at your "OAKS property" sign and I have a couple questions about it. You have the white background letters that I think are machined in with a pocketing program and then the red letters which were machined seperately and applied after painting. If those assumptions are correct then where / how did you find the complimentary fonts that have a similar shape and length but still leave so much border around the applied letters. Also your "e" in property has a small slit in the background letter. Did you VCarve that slit or just manually add it after machining?
Thanks for your answers in advance. Bob

[J Colvin]

Thanks James. That is a good looking sign but the customer specifically asked for wood so I am trying to work through that. The HDU samples I have come in 10, 15, and 20 lb. weights. What is you favorite and have you seen the splitting problems reported here on the forum in Ontario?
Bob

Wood signs look great, but if you seal up redwood cedar, it dosen't last. It needs to breathe. In the past we have just used stain on the background and paint on the raised sections with good results. But you have to restain when it starts to wash out the colour. I have been using 15lb hdu, and havent had any problems with cracks, maybe besause it doesn't get real hot up here. If the sign is properly supported you should be ok.
Thanks

[J Colvin]

I'm so glad to see so many posts on the topic of Sandblasting.

A few years ago this topic wouldn't even be appropriate. After all this is a router forum and sandblasting wasn't on the menu.

One little finishing hint: I leave an outline for all my lettering. That not only adds interest but it also allows for little mistakes.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e115/jcrumley1/PleasantOaksCopyClose-Up.jpg

James,

Congratulations on the excellent sign. Your technique is top notch. I look forward to seeing more of your creative work. The background texture is one of the best I've seen. Where can I get a copy of it.


Joe Crumley
www.normansignco.com

Thank You Joe, you also do good work, my texture is a partworks pattern I made up. I used a 3 deg .125 ball. The stepover leaves lots of fins sticking up that you just snap off with your fingers.
I can email the vector texture file if you want to try it.
Thanks
Jamie
jamiecolvin@xplornet.com

[joe]

James,

I make back off of my attempts to do 3D wood grain form my sandblasted panels. If I can't work out my problems in a few days I may resort to building a file like yours.

I appreciate your offer but I don't have anything ShopBot. So I doubt a partworks file would work.

About wood signs: I haven't been staining my wood signs until last year. All my wood signs are primed with "Block Out White" and painted with acrylic latex paint. They haven't had any problems so far. I've had some of them out for the better part of twenty years.

Bob.

The sign your asking about is sandblasted. The letters aren't pocketed. The Cranberry letters have been but from 1/4" PVC and applied. The little slit in the "E" is part of the sandblasting process. To get the grain pattern I used a Grain Frame.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e115/jcrumley1/PleasantOaksCopyAlteredinPS.jpg

You fellows keep up the good work.

Joe Crumley
www.normansignco.com

[J Colvin]

That is one awesome sign! This is a great fourm! It's nice to see what others can create too.
Jamie

[joe]

Bob,

Thanks for the complements. To answer your question about font selection;

This is a topic which is seldom discussed. At the June workshop I'll be spending considerable time on the importance of finding the right letter style. After buying an expensive CNC, and pouring out big bucks for software to drive it, you aren't going very far without good fonts. They are one of the essential keys to success. The days of hand letteing are, for the most part, gone and most newbees know nothing about the architecture of fonts. I see "Signs Now"opening all over the place with no one in them having any design background. That's the competition and they are sitting ducks for a skilled artist.

Another essential technique when building a sign is combining and altering fonts from different families. And knowing the fundamentals of letter distortions. One of the reasons that distortion modules aren't used very much is they are tough, hard, to use without strict limits. That is to say, letters go wonkie fast without good guide lines.

The artist has done an excellent job of moving our eye all over the place. It's hard for me to imagine a more exciting, kinetic advertising piece.

To me this is exciting and kinetic and it causes the eye to move all over the place.

Last weekend on a cross country motorcycle ride I stopped at a little museum for a break. I spotted this publication in one of their display cases. That discovery was the highlight of my trip. The Masthead was designed around the turn of the century. It, by itself is what commercial artwork is all about. These fellows knew about distortions and font architecture. If we study these examples and practice some of their techniques it will add quality to your work.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e115/jcrumley1/Beades2copy.jpg

Joe Crumley