Old machine Old SW

[birdsofplay]

Yep , I'm back !

I have been running my old Bot with a Steel table and Win95/98 on a
an OLd Laptop without any network.

I've been moving files to the Laptop via a CD.

So I got a free 3+Ghz, 2 GB ram 80Gb Hd ,WinXP machine from a friend.

I slapped a USB-Net thang on it and it communicates with all my other computers now.

I next tried it on my Bot as it has an old fashioned serial port.
My OLD Bot controller still sports the Blue Earth board.

While it Works and Cuts files it also has a very disconcerting shudder
every so often.

It cut a whole sheet of Foam which is my primary use, and returned to 0,0
so that shudder doesn't seem to be ruining my registration.

The old SW has a smooth cut option - No improvement.

Windows is running the Old SW in comparability mode.

Should/Could I try LOWER serial port speeds ?

Would Blocking help any ?

Has anyone figured out how to SMOOTH out things with this combo ?

Thanks in advance,

Bob Neitzke
Northwest Cutout Service
RCneitzke@centurytel.net
www.balsabuddies.com

[billp]

Bob,
Welcome back !
It's possible that your machine is in SHOCK after running off that older rig for ALL these years !!!!!
Just a guess here, a lot of guys have had "issues"with any computer that is connected to a network, have you tried it as a stand alone machine yet?
PS- We're gonna be having this year's Northwest Camp In Vancouver, WA on Sat. Oct. 6th....

[Brady Watson]

Hey Bob,
Nice to see you again! I was wondering how you 'made out'...



Windows is running the Old SW in comparability mode.


This is a bad idea. If you are running a PRT, download SB 3.4.27 and install it. Make sure you flash the firmware to the BE board before running. Running a Bot in DOS within XP or 7 is clunky at best. The Windows software will smooth out your tool a little and give you more refined ramp tuning than DOS. You can also run a USB to serial converter if your new computer ever bites the dust...

If you are running a PR, you're out of luck...Unless you upgrade to at least PRT controls.

-B

[curtiss]

I believe Bill Gates once said no one would EVER need more than 8 megs of RAM.
Bot on with Win 95.

[birdsofplay]

Brady: like I said I have the OLD controller and steppers et al old old old !

I was hoping that somebody had might have a trick for XPpro.

I spoz I could try booting WIn 98 from a CD or
create another partition an boot 98 from there.

I'll click OFF the net and see what happen next.

I mean ... IT'S REAL CLOSE TO working OK. ( for me )

Bill: Oct 6 ! I might be able to make it this year.

BTW, What are they askin' for a new controller ?
One the runs the new WinXP Pro compatible stuff.

I know the new Steppers and gearing are lots more powerful and accurate but
I am satisfied, for what I do, with what I have.
I have some bigger NEMA 35's laying around here but never implemented them.
I even have spare Driver boards but have never needed them !

L8r
guys :-)

Bob


Back when I bought my Bot there were LESS decimal places in the Price !!!

[Brady Watson]

Bob,
Are you running a Cable Drive, PR or PRT?

-B

[danhamm]

Nice seeing a post from you Bob, was in the shopbot archives awhile back and got locked into reading the old posts and was wondering...ltr..

[birdsofplay]

Brady,

Way back in the old days as Shopbot was developing their Gear drive solution,
I, in parallel, developed my own rack and pinion drive to replace the miserable
Cable drive that I originally purchased.

I still use the old smaller Steppers but geared them to turn a pinion on a Rack that
I installed outside and underneath. Similar to what SB developed.
My gear ratios are higher due to weaker motors but my cut speeds a normal.
It's just my Jogs that are slow- I can LIVE with it however.

The SB solution Upped the Gearing, Power and resolution and Cost.

Back in those days I could get a local fab house to cut parts for a 10' steel table for $100.

I've switched from MicroStation to Rhino3D also.

These days I cut foam model airplane parts. some ply and an occasional Sign
or deco thingy.
I also have done 3D molds for Canopys, intakes and turtle decks on Model airplanes.
All to be Vac formed later.

Nothing Heavy duty and no serious side loads either.

It turned out that NOBODY wanted to PAY for the Dinosaurs in ply or plastic !

My Bot is left over from a previous business so I do odd jobs.

I have YET to try the "NO Networking" suggestion postulated above.

Maybe tomorrow.

My Puzzlement is simply that the Serial port sends data to the Controller board in Blocks, so SERIAL port "interrupt/lapses" shouldn't be screwing with Controller output speeds, right? at least not except for every 2048 or so, right ?

So why should WinXp Pro be screwing with the smoothness of my operations ?

If this was a Step and Direction type of implementation then I could understand it.

Oh well,

CU L8r

BOb

[Brady Watson]

The days of $100 steel tables are LONG gone...as are other most things. I'm afraid there is no easy remedy for your setup, other than to upgrade to a cheap PRT control box or build a Win98SE or DOS only computer.

As I said before, running SB2 from a command window is a no-no. Your pulse rate is very low on that tool, so you are just barely getting away with it.

-B

[birdsofplay]

Well I have to report that I am absolutely amazed by the improvement
AFTER turning OFF the Networking !

Much much smoother !

Procedurally, I will simply have to Xfer my cutting files from my IN-HOUSE system
TO the the Shop PC and THEN KILL the network before doing cutting ops !
Or just use a USB drive stick.

I can live with either of those options.

I might even look into WHAT ELSE I can get away with KILLING in the Task Manager list.

No one has ventured an answer to my question re UPGRADING costs
to the New control box.

I dont even know if Shopbot "HAS" a Control box only purchase item.

Yeah yeah I'd LOVE to have the NEW Steppers but I have little need for them
doing the kinds of cutting I currently am involved with.

Anyway ... for now I will just keep plugging along with what I have.

Thanks for the SHUTOFF THE NETWORKing tip !

C U L8r

Bob

[steve_g]

http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15691 (http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15691)

don't know if this would do what you want...

SG

[billp]

Bob,
Other than following up leads here on the Forum as Steve has posted, your best bet is to call Shopbot directly and see if they have anything that would work to upgrade your setup. Your major advantage is that since you are starting from "way back" just about ANYTHING should give you faster, and smoother performance. There are also some links to the "Black Viper" web page which will suggest other things you can get rid of to further improve the computer's performance.
"It turned out that NOBODY wanted to PAY for the Dinosaurs in ply or plastic !" There are probably hundreds of people reading this Forum who have since learned the same thing, but few realize that we all owe YOU thanks for those original Dino files.....

[birdsofplay]

Bill,

I am going to try to make it to Vancouver this Oct 6.
"IF" I have not sold my home yet ( again this season )

Thanks for the Black Viper tip.

And Thanks for the comps on those Dino files.

Actually someone else did the Triceratops and I kinda did the rest.

Now off the visit the Black Viper :-)

Bob

[jerry_stanek]

I have an old PR that I put the 4g upgrade on and It is really a great upgrade my machine runs smother and faster.

[birdsofplay]

Jerry,

I have NOT been paying attention much for quite some time.

SO 4g ???

No clue

Bob

[Brady Watson]

4G = 4th Generation PRT Controls

You're rollin' 1G right now... :eek:

You should check out a newer Bot in person soon...Something from 2005 or newer, so you can 'get it'. Everything from hardware to software has advanced in quantum leaps forward since you last checked in...

-B

[billp]

Bob,
What Brady was politely trying to say was that you probably modeled the dinosaur files from the herds that were running outside your shop when you first got your machine.....

[birdsofplay]

Bill& Brady,

Thanks for wiseing me up :-)

Even so, my DinoBot does a respectable job and earns a good $$$, when in use.

So I guess nobody around here has ever even SEEN a wooden Table ? :-)
From the current pricing I can assunme that the minimalist spirit of the old days has "taken a Hike" .

Being retired means no new machine for Bob, unless I win the lotto.

Any minor improvments will have to be done by me.

Looking at the Pix that Steve Glassel provided ( thanks),
I have to wonder where all the Serious Power comes from these days.
Like Where is the uProc and where are the heavily heatsinked power Mosfets for those new monster steppers ?


My Next "Machine" will be a 4 axis Hot Wire Foam Cutting Contraption.
Built from Unistrut and or slotted angle.
I already have the stepper drive board working for it.

Bill, I'll see you in Vancouver in Oct.

L8r

Bob

[garyc]

Bob...
Bill can tell you about my minimalist traits when you see him in VC, BC. Here is a link to my "old" 2010 iron. Not quite as advanced as the current stuff, but close.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VGduUHEjv8&list=UUl3fUyY3Nq1H5E9wEAzld2Q&index=3&feature=plcp

[birdsofplay]

Gary , Nice vid. thanks for sharing.

I like that tool changer !

Bob

[birdsofplay]

Answering my own question re Power to steppers.

I appears that the SB control box is only providing signals to steppers
which have integrated Power chips on each motor.

That is why I initially doubted the control box, with no heat sinks.

Sorry.

Bob

[Brady Watson]

Post some pics...

Not still going to PhotoMat are you? :eek:

-B

[birdsofplay]

It's been a while since I started this thread.

Currently I have it working to my satisfaction USING WinXP Pro.

Yesterday I nabbed a DELL 17" Flat Screen for $15 at Goodwill.

I'm happy to report that IT WORKS !

Yes it's low rez and only 8ms but I have OLD SW and dont care. :-)

So I thoughe why not get rid of as much Windows **** as I can.
Media Player, Java, Search, Audio whatever all GONE !
As I discover more THEY will get axed as well.

Killed as many "Update thangs" As I could find.
Speaking as an entrenched Dino, I am Obviously NOT much interested in much updating.

It JOGGed from Home to the Opposite corner at 3 ips with no glitches !
I actually like NON scary Jog speeds

I cut several jobs at 1.5 ips with no lost registration !

So for now, I am Done fiddling around and or worrying about a FAST PC with WinXP !

Of course I would LOVE to have a new Bot especially the Alpha.
I'd also like to be 30 yrs younger and drive a Lamborghini, but
Unless I win a lotto or hit a Jackpot get some really LARGE jobs
or actually talk to God, well ... C'est la vie

I'll probably only BE happy with my setup until I go to the
Vancouver WA Camp in Oct. So I have couple of months of
blissful unawareness to enjoy.

C U there,

Bob

[billp]

Bob,
That's the pragmatic school of CNC- if it works, it's good ! Glad to hear you're back in the game.....

[Still_Cable_Driven]

Good to hear (yes, sure, I'm late to the party - I was under a rock when this was posted, shop-bot wise.)

Wooden table, cable drive, 1G controls. Your homebrew-non-cable is reminding me of the sprocket and chain folks that were another self-upgrade path. :D