Composite Nails

[GlenP]

For all you guys that don't use vacuum hold down. I found this product the other day. They look like they would work well instead of screws or metal fasteners. Also if you watch the video it shows a shopbot and I think Ted??
http://raptornails.com/index.php

[gene]

I purchased one a while back and they do good. I have a vac but there is still a time here and there that it is very useful

[coryatjohn]

Where did you actually buy them from?

[Brady Watson]

You can buy them here: http://www.boatdesigns.com/

Search for: 'Omer' and it will bring up a list of guns.

-B

[coryatjohn]

Does this product require the specialized gun or can I use my existing PC guns?

[garyr6]

The manufacturer certainly say it requires their gun. But I believe some of the Botter's here have noted that they use standard gun. Maybe they could speak up.........
It does look like a good idea...... I know I looked into it.

[GlenP]

I have a message into my area supplier with questions about gun required and will post what answer I get.

[coryatjohn]

I ordered a box of 1" 18 gauge nails. If it works in my old PC gun, that will be great. If not, it's a wasted $20 so no big deal. I can't see spending $200+ for specialized gun.

[jhedlund58]

I tried those 18 ga. only little longer 1.25" in PC and Bostich guns to no success. they broke off before setting completely. I still use the reg 18ga brads for hold downs. never hit a brad yet!!! hoping if I do, the bit will go right through without breaking. bit may still be ruined. the project may live. you may have better luck... still worth a try... I guess

[bleeth]

The Omer gun will shoot regular pins also. It is a higher quality gun than PC or Bostich. The issue I have with PC/Bostich is their pin guns are basically throw-away with lesser quality materials. A better gun is worth repairing and, like a better quality router bit that is worth re-sharpening, will have much more life in the long run.
Of course, that opinion comes from one who uses his nail guns on a very heavy basis and likes buying better quality tools, right down to the Snap-On screwdrivers, wrenches, and sockets in my toolbox.

[khaos]

Snap-On? You can't hide money. hee hee ;)

[gene]

I purchased it from Anco Fasteners in Eugene Oregon 541 485 2800. the company will send you a gun and nails to try if you dont like it return it. They are in texas theit contact info is Raptor nails and composits Round Rock texas 800 460 2800. The only thing i use it for is in the shopbot

[bleeth]

"Snap-On? You can't hide money. hee hee ;)"

That's why I don't have any!!!!

[Bob Eustace]

Thanks for posting Glen - very impressive and so quick. Curious why in the video the guy used tabs if they work so well?

[gene]

I think its so they can show them being cut and no bit damage , I think

[blackhawk]

The Raptor nails are cool, but I just like screws. I don't have vac hold down, so I screw most everything. After I get my cutting layout exactly right, I go back in Aspire (or whatever program) and just draw circles everywhere that I need a screw. If I am using an 1/8" endmill, I draw 1/8" circles, 1/4" endmill, 1/4" circles, etc. Then I just create a drilling toolpath that just goes .010" to .015" deep. This is just enough to mark where I want the screws. You can run that at jog speeds and it just takes a minute or two on a full sheet of plywood. I am putting in the screws as the bot is drilling the next one.

[jerry_stanek]

The Raptor nails are cool, but I just like screws. I don't have vac hold down, so I screw most everything. After I get my cutting layout exactly right, I go back in Aspire (or whatever program) and just draw circles everywhere that I need a screw. If I am using an 1/8" endmill, I draw 1/8" circles, 1/4" endmill, 1/4" circles, etc. Then I just create a drilling toolpath that just goes .010" to .015" deep. This is just enough to mark where I want the screws. You can run that at jog speeds and it just takes a minute or two on a full sheet of plywood. I am putting in the screws as the bot is drilling the next one.


I just draw circles for screw holes when I need them doesn't matter if they are .125 or 2.5 it will drill in the center

[gene]

I have used my composite nailer to attach a new spoilboard when i have to. i have a 7.5 hp roots blower vac on my machine but sometimes i will have a corner on a sheet of wood lift so i use the gun as a helper to the vac also or if the wood i am cutting is too small for the vac to be useful there goes another nail:)

[coryatjohn]

I received my Raptor 18 gauge 1" composite nails today. I tried them in my Porter Cable gun. For the test I used 75psi attaching 1/4" MDF to a 2x4with varying countersink settings.

Most seated correctly. Some snapped off the last 1/4" when rapid firing. The surprise was really when I tried to take the two pieces apart. With regular metal nails, I could have easily separated the two pieces even with 15 nails. All it would have taken is a steady pressure and it would have giving up the bond. This could be an issue with hold down.

With these composite nails, they melt as they go in and are like a sort of glue bond. The MDF broke when I pried it apart with a crowbar.

Using a PC nail gun might not work as well as their $200 fancy gun but it did work adequately for my needs. It will be nice to have this in the arsenal for hold down. My usage scenario would be for edges of thin material where the vacuum isn't holding it.

I may be that shorter nails work better than longer ones. There was a report earlier in this thread about 1.25" nails not working well. I used 1" and they were satisfactory. 3/4" would probably work just fine in any gun.

One other minor note. If you shoot one of these nails into your leg, the only way a doctor will be able to find it is by PROBING! That's gonna hurt.

[jhedlund58]

There is still a chance the plastic nails work better with the intended gun and probably worth the cost... I use 18 gauge brads where most put wood screws. works for me... haven't hit one yet.... sure the bit will go right through it without much damage to bit. Just me... u can over think this stuff

[sailfl]

How do you remove them once you have milled the wood?

[Simops]

I've been using the raptor nylon nails for last year or so to nail down the spoilboard to the deck. Then when surfacing the spoilboard the cutter just glides through the nails without causing damage.

Cheers

[Bob Eustace]

Come on Mike - please share the knowledge with your fellow Aussies. Where did you get it and how much please? Do you think you could hold down 3/4 to 1" hardwood for signs? Can you get away with one gun? What air supply are you using?

[gene]

I use mine for holding rough cut wood pine and cedar to cut signs out of . It does good

[Bob Eustace]

Gene - nails or staples?

[Simops]

Come on Mike - please share the knowledge with your fellow Aussies. Where did you get it and how much please? Do you think you could hold down 3/4 to 1" hardwood for signs? Can you get away with one gun? What air supply are you using?

Oh no secret Bob....called Raptor and there is a Dealer on the NSW north coast. Got a box from him.....still heaps left as only use it to nail down the spoilboard. They are tough as they do melt slightly as they go in but still easy to pry apart when changing the spoilboard.

They recommend their gun to use them (and probably better) but they fit into my el cheapo pro-air gun from Bunnings and work OK as long as you do it slow.

I'm away at the moment but when I get back home tonight I'll look up the suppliers name here in AUS and the size nails I got.

Cheers

[gene]

Nails , they will tell you that you only need 1/4 to 3/8 thru your materials to hold . they have superior pull strength but way less shear strength. all i do to release the materials from the shopbot is to hit it sideways and it snaps off. then sand off the parts sticking up if any

[coryatjohn]

Nails , they will tell you that you only need 1/4 to 3/8 thru your materials to hold . they have superior pull strength but way less shear strength. all i do to release the materials from the shopbot is to hit it sideways and it snaps off. then sand off the parts sticking up if any

That's great!

[gene]

I have a friend who has a omer composite gun that he doesnt use very much , i'LL See if he wants to sell it and let you know