Dressing up a sign with 23K Gold

[joe]

I know, I know it's too expensive. Not only that customers wouldn't like it.

The price of a book of gold which is 25 sheets measuring 3.25" X 3.25" cost about $55. That will go a long way to dress up a sign. You'll have a difficult time when selling if you ask them if they would like some gold on it. The answer is NO. So I seldom as that question. But when they come to collect their panel or if they come by to check on the progress and see the progress it's often a jaw dropping moment. That's what gold can do.

Here are some example for the past few weeks.

[Simops]

Wow does look good.....really makes the sign pop!

Not just signs .... But could be used in other projects such as furniture carvings.....

Thanks for showing the pics....

[joe]

Michael,

That's correct, there are several types of gold application. A general description goes like this. Most furniture and picture framing is down with Water Gilding. It's brighter and more glossy but it's for interiors application. If you have a few moments, Youtube has lots of gilding examples that are fun to watch.

Then there's oil gilding most commonly used on signs. It's the most popular method. In short, you lay down the oil size, which is varnish, let it set up to become sticky, then apply the gold. This material will last for years and as everyone knows it won't tarnish. The only problem down here is the wind that carries dirt and sand. That will take if off over time. To counter this it's good to lay down a coat of automotive clear.

The last process which is seldom used and almost a secret called Instacoll. It's a two part size which gives a much brighter sheen. I haven't tried any of the latex sizes but I'm sure they would also work.

I personally feel everyone in the sign business should have a sample or two showing 23K. There's something about it that takes a panel to another level. But watch out it's contagious.

Here are a couple more showing the effect. The last one was done by my good friend Mark Yearwood.

[myxpykalix]

Anytime i see gold on a sign it reminds me of how they used to do it as a kid and you would see gold on bank windows and signs and at jewelry stores.:D

[kartracer63]

Jack,

I really like the "old time" store front windows with gold too. You don't see them too often anymore. If you see one, take pictures.

Nowadays, it seems like everything is white vinyl and block letters.

[khaos]

Joe, didn't you tell me "Gold is gold and paint aint."?

[Mayo]

Sadly, with the over abundance of sign shops that only do vinyl signs, real gold is seldom seen on signs around here any more.

One of the best places to see gold leaf on signs and shop windows is Disney World and Epcot Center. The craftsmanship is top notch and of course money is no object. There are amazing examples of old methods such as glue chipped glass, smalts, back painted blended colors, engine turning, etc. and 99% of the people there just walk past without giving a second look.

I spent most of two days there photographing the signs. People looked at me like I was crazy. I was lucky enough to watch one of their sign guys perfectly applying full sheets of gold leaf to a window as if it was as easy as stirring paint.

Memories of amazing looking gold leaf windows in Chicago - especially on on Cigar stores and banks.
I wonder if anyone salvaged any of that glass when white helvetica sprang up everywhere?

[joe]

In some area's gold is often used. Here at our capitol building it's considered a must. Also we have lots of casino's wanting it. But the largest user I know of is Las Vegas. Almost all of it is glass gold, in the same way as Disney.

Glass gold is often accompanied with different colors of mica, mother of pearl and carnival gold.

For us little guys, it's still a treat to dress up a panel.

One of the possibilities for Gilding is gifts. This should be a natural for the holidays.

The photo below was a HDU sign hale damaged almost beyond repair.

[joe]

Greetings everyone,

A good place to order these products is "Letterhead Sign Supply" it's a good company and Kristie would be happy to take your order. Another gold supply is L.A. Gold.

Be sure to order patent and not loose leaf.

When searching the internet the price of gold is all over the place. The Brand I've been using for years is "Manetti" I've also used Crockodile from Australia but 23K is all about the same color.

The "Gold Size", which is a varnish, can be fast dry or slow dry. Try to get the slow. It will give you several hours before laying down the gold. All brands seem to be about the same quality.

Joe

[bobmoore]

Joe;
Can I assume then that you recommend the slow dry oil over the instacoll? I really want to put some some gold leaf on a couple signs.
Thanks Bob

[joe]

Bob,

Instacoll will give the most brilliant effect. It needs to be used for special occasions. It can look what I call the "Barbie Doll" look. It's also expensive.

Slow size is good to start out with.

One more thing about gold size. It's a varnish that will dry evely. Regular varnish skims over on the top. Your looking for a size that won't down the gold leaving a low lust ugly painted look. The dryer the varnish the brighter the sheen.

[joe]

Bob,

Instacoll will give the most brilliant effect. It needs to be used for special occasions. It can look what I call the "Barbie Doll" look. Kind of cheap. It's also expensive.

Slow size is good to start out with. It's what most pro's use. Many gilders combine 50% slow to 50% fast.

One more thing about gold size. It's a varnish that will dry evely. Regular varnish skims over on the top. Your looking for a size that won't drown the gold leaving a low lust ugly painted look. The dryer the varnish the brighter the sheen.

[bobmoore]

Thanks Joe;
I build mostly western red cedar signs. I will try letterhead supply for sizing as well as the gold leaf. Hopefully they will steer me in the right direction for the best sizing for a wood sign. Should I seal the wood first or put sizing right to the wood surface?
Bob

[David Iannone]

Joe,
Excellent work as usual.
My question is about clear coat. I have done very little gold leafing, but the few projects I did turned out ok, but one time I did do a clear coat over the gold leaf and ruined it. It cracked it up, like maybe I didn't let the sign sit long enough after applying the leaf? I cleared it with a clear gloss of Mathews Acrylic Polyurethane paint system. NEVER clear coated since because I figured it was overkill anyway. It also seemed to take away that brilliant gold shine. Is there a brand of clear for the best results?
Thanks,
Dave

[joe]

David,

Excellent question and I'm glad you posted on the topic.

There are occasions when it's important to topcoat. With window lettering ,vehicle graphics, motorcycle decorations, and on transoms of boats it's just about mandatory to have a protective coating. For years varnish was used but it wasn't as long lasting as catalized acrylic.

The problem is, as you said, the new hot acrylics attack the underlying soft varnish size. The technique is to allow the size a day or two to set up and then apply an light coat, letting it set for a day or two then come back with a heavier finish coat.

New on the market are acrylic latex clear's that should work. Modern Masters has a clear gloss I've used on several non gold panels and it flows out nicely. Also Nova Color has a clear but I haven't tired it out.

It's true any clear degrades the brilliance but with the right clear there isn't much. Still I hate to do it but that's sometimes necessary.

[SomeSailor]

I do vinyl boat signs and often use a product called "Real Gold" or "Sign Gold". It's a 22 carat product that really makes a difference on a boat transom.

[joe]

I agree with Mike about the 22K gold on vinyl rolls. It comes as patent and textured surface. Because you'll be paying for all the gold on the roll it's very expensive. That is to say all the area you weed out and throw in the waste basket is gold lost. But still it brings the effect of gold which is what you're after.

[ssflyer]

Isn't that what they make Aqua regia for? :eek: I actually used this concentrated nitro-hydrochloric acid back in my early gold mining days for fine gold recovery. Kind of surprised I'm still upright... :cool:

[joe]

If there's one critical part of laying gold it's the timing of when to apply the gold. The other steps in gilding aren't critical or difficult but you'll be making a judgment call about tack of the size. If the gold is applied too soon, while the varnish is wet, you'll end up with a depressed sheen. It' will look like a poor imitation gold paint job. And you've wasted your time and materials. There's a time window when you'll get your best gild. On the other hand if you wait too long the gold won't stick.

To eliminate the guessing, you can brush out a few lines of the size for testing. You'll know when you're about ready when the size become tacky. If you wipe your finger over one of the test stripes it should be squeaky and not come off on your finger. Here's the trick. There's squeaky and there's squeaky. If Slow size is used, your window is generious with plenty of time to gild. The longer you wait the brighter the sheen. I wait until the size is just about dry. It's amazing to me size although it feels dry will still take the gold. If you wait a little too long a hair dryer sometimes will bring enough of the oils to the surface to finish the job.

If you're using slow size, there's going to be a wait. several hours or overnight. It's best to place some kind of cover over the pieces to prevent dust.