Help! Bought PRTAlpha 60x120 w/ SEV HSD AT/MT 1073-140 Spindle and Yaskawa V74X VFD

[leehoffman]

Hello!
I just purchased a PRT Alpha 60x120 with SEV HSD AT/MT 1073-140 Spindle and Yaskawa V74X VFD.

Does anybody on this forum have this combination? If so, could you open your VFD and snap a few pictures?

A brown wire (a black and white small control wire in a brown jacket) that goes between the control box and the VFD was tugged a bit too hard when we were taking the control box and VFD off the wall at the place I bought it. It pulled the brown wire out the bottom of the VFD. So, I did not get a chance to see where it was supposed to be terminated.

I have it home now, and under power. But, I can't use the RPM control box in partworks to change the VFD speed. This leads me to believe the brown wire was the link between the control box and VFD to adjust speed. The VFD can power on, and you can manually adjust speed using the buttons on the face of the VFD itself.

I opened the silver control box, the brown wire has a white, and a black small wire connected to the VFD(1) DCM and FWD terminals on the control board as they should be. The wire goes to the VFD, through the rubber grommet. There are two loose terminals inside the VFD where the screws are not all the way tightened. I am thinking they might be the ones where the wires pulled out and should be connected? There is also one black wire coming from the orange cable from the spindle that is not attached to anything. Not sure if that was already like that, or was attached to one of my two disconnected wires from the control box.

The instruction manual (original that came with shopbot in 2004) has instructions for wiring a "Colombo Spindle" which I do not have. The previous owner has a page printed out from the manual, then some hand writing scratching out the part that shows the terminals to connect to inside the VFD. This is probably since it does not really match the inside of the Yaskawa vfd that I have. Their notes say something about "not for our driver" or something. So... I am lost where to connect to and don't want to short anything out guessing on making connections.

I found this guide, but it only states that the "brown wire comes from the VFD" and then tells you where to connect into the control box. I have the reverse, its connected to control box, but not to the VFD now...

http://www.shopbottools.com/ShopBotDocs/files/HSD%20spindle%20install%20PRTA%202013%2009%2024.pd f

Questions:
1. Can this shopbot control spindle speed via partworks? both manually, and if I program tools in partworks to run at different speeds?

2. where do I connect the black and white wires (in brown jacket) inside the VFD?

Please see these pictures for clarification.

Installed in wood boat building shop in Olympia, WA:
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Reinstalled in my garage in Colorado:
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Spindle
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VFD
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Inside control box. Brown wire is terminated per correctly per the original shopbot manual.
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[leehoffman]

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Notes from the previous owner.
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[leehoffman]

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[dmidkiff]

http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=27488&stc=1http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=27489&stc=1http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=27490&stc=1Here are some pics of my setup. My spindle is a different model but the VFD appears the same on the out side. The black wire is connected to S1 and the white wire is connected to a larger white wire from the orange spindle cable with a wire nut and then connected to SC. Hope this helps.http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=27491&stc=1

[leehoffman]

Thank you! I received a similar reply from shopbot.
They said "The control wire gets connected to SC (white) and S1 (black) in the VFD. SC should equate to DCM.

There should be an S4 and SC connection for the thermal switch or thermistor. That might be where the loose black wire is coming from but I can’t say for certain since it isn’t labeled."

I am not really sure what he means by the second part about the thermal switch/thermistor.

From my CNC at work and the photos you posted, it looks to me like my loose black wire is supposed to be spliced to the white SC wire. What is troubling me is that in your CNC and at work, the wire going into the the orange cable that goes to the spindle, is white, not black. Also, you'd think there would be wire nut/cap sitting in the bottom of the VFD....

I opened the CNC where i work. Found a similar thing to what you are showing in your photos. The white wire is tapped, and connected to a wire going into the orange cable that goes to the spindle. only in your photo, your wire is white heading into the orange cable bundle.

Here is the setup at my work

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[leehoffman]

also, I noticed you have a silver USB cable inside your VFD in your picture. what is it there for? Where does it plug into?

is it for something like this?

Installing the Spindle RPM Controller (Yaskawa VFDs)
http://www.shopbottools.com/ShopBotDocs/files/RPM%20control%20install%20Yaskawa%20VFD%202011%200 7%2012.pdf

[leehoffman]

I think i see what's happening. maybe my white and black are opposite yours and my work cnc.

there is a black wire coming from the orange cable. it goes into the white wire nut, and a black wire goes from that up to SC on the VFD terminal block. The S1 terminal block is empty, and the screw is loose.

So, I am thinking the white wire from the brown cable goes to S1 and the black wire goes to the wire nut (ie SC and the spindle)

I am not sure if that extra wire goes to anything.... maybe it was never connected anywhere?

In my control box, white goes to DCM and Black to FWD. So, if my wires are opposite, does your black go to DCM and white to FWD? Do you think you could snap a quick pic of where they terminate in the control box? Thank you SO MUCH.

That is not what this document states:
http://www.shopbottools.com/ShopBotDocs/files/HSD%20spindle%20install%20PRTA%202013%2009%2024.pd f

confused....
will I hurt anything by firing it up if my wires are crossed? I can try it each way and see what happens

Thanks!
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[dmidkiff]

It appears to me that we have different equipment. Maybe that doesn't matter. I can't help you much with the electronics except to supply pics and tell you to reach out to tech support. I think they would be happy to walk you through the wiring and start up. Maybe some of the more knowledgeable guys could chime in. Don't hesitate to ask for more pics. The USB cable is plugged into the USB hub at the PC. There is another coming from the control box.
http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=27512&stc=1http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=27513&stc=1

[leehoffman]

thank you for the pics! yep, yours seems to be reverse of mine in the VFD, but the same in control box.

I can't equate it to my work shopbot since its newer and in the control panel there is no "VFD" terminals with DCM or FWD. Its says something about "spindle" where the wires are terminated.

anyway, I did contact shopbot originally and then again once I realized my wires might be reversed. Wish I could call, but my day job doesn't allow much time.

Here is how the conversation went:

Shopbot:
"The FWD and DCM wires work connected either way so it doesn’t matter if they are reversed. If you aren’t getting an EF4 error then the thermal switch is connected and you should be good to go."

Me:
"Are you saying color of the wires is irrelevant if the are connected properly... or that dcm/fwd in controller can be connected interchangeably with s1/sc in the vfd? Thank you"

Shopbot:
"There is a relay on the control board that closes and shorts the two wires together to tell the spindle to turn on so it is basically like closing a switch. If the wire are reversed when the relay closes you are still shorting the two wires together and accomplishing the same thing. You can test by touching the two wires together to see if the spindle turns on. If it doesn’t the VFD might not be programmed correctly."

So, I am going to try connecting things back together and see what happens. It seems which wire goes where might not matter.
Lee

[dmidkiff]

Sounds like it doesn't matter about color of wires. Let us know how it works.