3D retaill therapy:)

[scottp55]

Rainy day here,and somebody was interested in Desktop's detail work....soooo
Went on line and shopped on Ebay to increase my 3D library:)
Only did this one in a scrap of Black Walnut so far.
Onsrud .25" 30 engraving with the .01" flat, offset/conventional 1,1,18K 10% stepover(I called it the .005"flat)
It was only a test, but I'll keep it:)
NO sanding:)
Oh..Does anybody know the artist...it looks familiar.
scott

[myxpykalix]

Scott, that's neat but who did you get to model a 3d image of you? That is you...right? lol

[bob_s]

Scott
impressive detail
i think that was modeled in ZBrush, I think I saw it on their forum a while back
what was the cut time?
the size looks like 2 1/2 x4" Is that a good guess?
Do you think it would look the same at 2 ips ?
that definitely has the detail I'm after, just trying to get a guess on what time a 10 x 15 would take to cut?
thanks
Bob

[dmidkiff]

Scott, that is very impressive.

[scottp55]

Cute Jack:)
I figured out after I bought it, that the reason I did was probably because I can imagine looking in a mirror in 30 years and that would be my expression,
While thinking "WHA HAPPENED!!" :)
Bob, actual size was 1.9X3" and time was 1:15:30 at 1,1.
Did this Curly Moose at 2,2,18K with the same bit described as a VBit at 1% step no roughing and it was about 5 hours
Funny thing...if you describe the engraving bit as a VBit...step is percentage of tool diameter,
IF as an engraving bit then it's the percentage of the Flat # and can go 10-20% step.
Almost exact same cutting times, only the fine details change. Finer, though exaggerated, detail when called a VBit.
Can't wait to try the Three Bears in the Woods, I bought after seeing Dan's work(Mine will be MUCH smaller out of Claro slab, and I'll probably chop the ornate frame out).
Can probably speed up by playing with Brady's VR #'s
Still using defaults but a .2" Z1 and a .02" Z2
scott

[scottp55]

OH,
On Old Man, because I used offset...it started at the top of his nose and then promptly plunged down off the tip:(
I duplicated the toolpath and changed MS to .4,.4 and just ran that toolpath for about a minute, and then stopped it and ran the 1,1 toolpath.
CEL on that bit is .5" and all file depths were changed to .47" max depth.

[scottp55]

Curly Moose was 9X5.4"

[scottp55]

Just found out we got Jury selected for our first show at the last minute.
NEXT WEEK!
http://www.nemadeshows.com/spring-show/
The reason we got in were the Judges LOVED the 3D Loon/Moose larger ones that Dad borrowed from the house on Weds.
This will be the next one, and may have to jury rig a quicky spoilboard for the second Desktop so 2 can be cutting at the same time.
There won't even be time to do more than a couple coats, never mind any significant sanding.
This one should be a good detail test.
Time to get ON my butt:)
scott

[cowboy1296]

I like and need that tree artwork, where did you find it at. Let me hi jack your site for a hardwood question. The black walnut that i am getting is not that impressive and need to substitute with another hardwood. I already work with cherry but need a substitute for black walnut. Which do you suggest. And if you have pictures of carvings in that wood please post.

[scottp55]

Rick, check your email in a couple minutes.
get back on woods later maybe.

[bleeth]

Rick: I can't think of a walnut sub right now but you may want to check these guys out:
http://www.gobywalnut.com/

Scott: Well done-use Brady's numbers. makes it run smoother as well as faster.

[scottp55]

I think it's going to be a Loooong night:)
File was so big I kept running out of memory, so finally said F it at 3PM and ran my first very conservative file:(
WAY too conservative:)
Dave, should have reread Brady's "Public Service Announcement" thread and the VR blog again about an hour earlier!
Oh well.
Got the crew showing up at 9am, but they Already know I'm crazy:)
Running at 1.2,1.2, 17K shortcut keyed to 2.2,1.2
scott

[scottp55]

With computer glitches and other problems with this 4 million plus lines of code, I got about 2 hours sleep with one eye and both ears open and fire extinguisher and smoke alarms within feet:)
Running a cropped version at different settings right now that should be done in 5 hours.
No sanding, and only last pic had oil on it.

[dmidkiff]

Wow Scott, I really like that tree. I did not see any fuzzies. Hope the 5hr one is as good.

[scottp55]

Thanks David:)
Cowboy E-mailed the guy and got the Tree by itself for some of his work:)
Turned out to be a 7:20:30 file at 2,2,18k with a 40% stepover(but I described the flat as .005" when it's actually .01")
At 1am it looked trashy with Maple Fuzzies, so I shut DC down and took dust foot off and did an RR....Spindle shut down 5 minutes ago.
Pics coming after Espresso IV has finished:)
scott

[bob_s]

Scott
i am assuming that you used V carve to tool path the STL file? Do you know how many polys or points the STL has? The detail on that cut looks like the quality that I'm after. I just am wondering how dense the 3D needs to be to get there
thanks
Bob

[cowboy1296]

I learn something new everyday, but educated me how you would v carve an stl file? That truhttp://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=27580&stc=1
ly is a question not a smart elic response. Now in this example the tree modeling depth is set at .4. It 10.5 x 8 inches. I tried using a 1/8 inch inch ball nose but you loose way to much quality, so it was done with a 1/16. With all of the z i could imagine this one to take a lot of cutting time.

[bob_s]

Cowboy;
Sorry for the misunderstanding, it is a 3d cut and I believe Scott uses Vcarve. VCarve was designed to cut using vector shapes, but the newer versions of Vcarve allow you to 3d cut one placed STL 3d file per "job". You can have many pieces of geometry or type, but only one 3d part. I previously owned Aspire with my large PRS machine, and using that you could make a composite scene from as many 3d parts or STL imported files as you wanted. I am interested in Scott's answer because I am seriously considering buying a Desktop Max to use for 3d art carvings, and it comes bundled with VCarve Pro. If that is what he used to tool path the 3d of this very nice carving, I will plan on using the same process. at least for a start to cut the 3d files I am beginning to make in ZBrush.
thanks
Bob

[scottp55]

You beat me to it Bob.
Yes, only VCP8 here on the Desktops.
I just woke up after a good 8 hours, and was just in the process of downloading pics, and was going to take some screenshots of that file size(THINK that was one that had a "small" and a "Large" .stl option(and I did the small). NO idea of polys or points.
GREAT work Rick!
On second one I increased model depth from .38" to .6" , but that was for the entire file(not just tree) and not sure I like it as much as the first proportional one.
You going to curve that onto a dome for one of your plaques?
More coming when eyelids unstick:)
scott

[cowboy1296]

I bought that oak tree to use in a carving that is a logo for a wounded vets group. But they wanted to stick with their logo tree which is very plain, but its whats they want. I am sure that i will use somewhere, maybe just as an accent

Sorry Bob i am just waking up and just misunderstood what you meant by v carve. I have just enough caffeine in me now to kick start my brain.

[scottp55]

Hope any of this helps Bob.
OH, as many of Vectric's formats as you want, but only one .stl. .obj etc per job with VCP8.

[scottp55]

Back on the booths display panel.
Got busy on other stuff, Middle one is cutting now...TREE only in a pocket like Rick's Preview.
Hoping incorporating that know will look ok:)
Same bit 2,2,18K 40% stepover(but I lied about the flat, so more like 20% stepover if I was actually using a .005" flat)

[scottp55]

I have the dust foot on after I took that pic of it cutting........
Halfway through I could see the trunk........WHAT THE....?
:(
That's what I get for rushing.
Preview from ALL angles!!
Ya ever feel like a fool?
I'll cut it again, deeper and correctly....unless I say it was a cookie mold:)

[scottp55]

Ever have "One of those Days" ?
Fixed that wrong combine mode on laptop....TOTALLY forgetting I had rezeroed my X,Y axis on the control computer to try to get that knot in the trunk of the tree.
Youch:(
Resized the darn thing and quadruple checked everything, and had .05" CEL left on the bit...up till 12:39 this morning babysitting(but I LIKE it:)
Shame the knot went from tight to punky, whereas the other side of the board, it's only interesting grain.
Glad that board is done...almost cut it into 3 pieces after looking at that perimeter pass, but then remembered I don't have a woodstove:)
scott

[scottp55]

This one's cutting right now.
Checked it maybe 10 times, and still worried like a Newbie before I pressed Start:)
Last 3D until this 3 day weekend's show is over.

[Tom-3344]

This one's cutting right now.
Checked it maybe 10 times, and still worried like a Newbie before I pressed Start:)
Last 3D until this 3 day weekend's show is over.

After all the suspense, I am going to have to go to the show to see how it all turned out.

Tom

[scottp55]

:)
Only 33% done, but on this one even I'm amazed at the detail the dustfoot is teasing me with!
It's a wholesale only show, but I'm keeping the "Old Man", and this "Old Town" one for myself (and 2 Quilted Maple)!! :)
You're welcome to drop by the house and watch the Desktop in person, just e-mail me under my contact info.
scott

[scottp55]

Feels like Christmas when one of your packages has a rip in the wrapping and you can see a Little... :)
You have to judge size by the dustfoot bristles.

[scottp55]

Straight off the machine, no sanding.

[scottp55]

A few more. 1 coat 50/50 Polymerized Linseed/Citrus thinner.
No sanding.

[scottp55]

Tom,
Thanks for dropping by the booth yesterday!
Made my day for someone to drive an hour to see our stuff:)
E-mail me to get the seller of that Tree you like so much.
Always nice to meet Shopbotters:)
There was a lady behind our booth that makes model kits on her Buddy(?) and a laser guy as you entered that had a Buddy years ago, and said he'd kill for a Desktop now to supplement the laser after seeing our booth:)
Nice Shopbot world out there for a regional show.
Great experience for our new operator of the second Desktop!
He's having a blast and his mind is running 180MPH.
Detail of the little 3D's blew a couple of wood people away after you left, and people started asking for stuff I never thought of.
Custom furniture guy wants hardwood engraved logo plates for his line, lady bought some buttons to make a short wine stop so it would fit in her fridge upright:)
That astro turf and the wiring speed bumps were hard! Taking the day off.
It was fun!!!
scott

[bleeth]

Glad you enjoyed. I got totally burnt out on working shows years ago but short ones like that can be fun.
10 Day Boat shows will kill you!

Send me that e-mail contact too Scott.

Thanks.

[scottp55]

You have mail Tom and Dave:)
I think the $5 hot dogs would make shows old quick:)
Kelly said she wore more comfortable shoes today...and Dad brought a seat cushion:)
scott

[bob_dodd]

Just a word caution , I purchased a couple using Paypal 2 days ago and there were unauthorized charges 2 days ago with out of country fees also , waiting for new card to come now

[scottp55]

Got to keep an eye on that, but no problems with the buyer I forwarded.
Guy from Vectric in MN just bought the "Tree Culon" also, and had no problems also.
Thanks for the heads up Bob
scott

[dmidkiff]

Scott, if the email was meant for me, thanks but I missed it or something. If it wasn't meant for me, I would like the info as well.

Thanks, Dave

[scottp55]

Hi David,
Nope, sent to Bleeth.
Might as well post it here.
Tree used in a basket weave is on page 1.
The one I bought is on page 2.
http://www.ebay.com/sch/m.html?item=161912296359&_ssn=27newstyle&rt=nc
Glad you're up and running again by the way :)
scott

[dmidkiff]

Thanks Scott. He has a lot of neat looking models.

[scottp55]

Thanks a LOT David:)
Revisited and just bought the lion head:)

[dmidkiff]

Downloading tree now. Says 45 min. Did it take that long for yours to download?

[scottp55]

Yes David, he includes a MIN, and a MAX res file and it's huge

[scottp55]

David, Do you have Aspire to separate the Tree from the background?
Glad you're going again.
Looking forward to this one I downloaded this morning, but have no idea where I'll use it:)
Have no idea what the Z is like yet.
Got a Brady scan of an antique Inuit Walrus Soapstone carving I need to try now that the Maple firewood with solid raised branch knots has dried enough to play with:)
3D may be very machine intensive ,but LOVE how it comes out:)
scott

[dmidkiff]

Downloaded all but no luck getting to Aspire. Out of practice and never used any models/files except from vectorart3D. I do have Aspire 4.5. Hope I don't have update to be able to get into Aspire. Have not had much time to explore some different things or go through the tutorials. Maybe later today. That lion head caught my eye too.

[scottp55]

Morning David,
You should have downloaded the "Tree Culon .zip" file right?
Unzip that, and you will see a .Rar file.....unzip that as well and you should have a folder that has what the third pic has.
Not sure about Aspire, but for .stl's and such for me, the only way to get them is the modeling tab and click the folder(in pic) or import it under file folder.
I use 7Zip to unzip stuff as it's free.
scott

[dmidkiff]

Thanks Scott, The first download was not zipped for some reason. It is downloading again now and seams to be zipped. We'll see. If it is a zipped file this time I will hopefully be able to follow your screen shots.

[dmidkiff]

Finally had good results yesterday morning. Frustrating when something simple doesn't work like expected. I had many pages open trying to figure how to open the tree. Finally gave up and walked away Saturday morning. Went to pick up granddaughter and at bedtime shut down all the pages and reset the screen saver. Sunday morning it opened in Aspire.

[scottp55]

Good David:)
Did the Lion in a 2x2" but used a scrap of Quilted and rastered it and shouldn't have.
Pics later, Ron and I just ran our first test run on the second Desktop setup,and NOTHING went wrong:)
Z upgrade, and then she can go to Ron's shop for production:)

[dmidkiff]

Good news when nothing goes wrong.

[scottp55]

Pics.
ALMOST a waste of Quilted scrap, but only 1 coat on surface so far, as it will be embedded in Claro slab and don't want the Linseed to creep yet.
Pretty good detail, but should have used Offset off the Nose ,instead of raster against grain,as Quilted Oregon Maple is squirrely grained, and I'd relieved the cut already which lead to chipping/grain splitting on edges.
No sanding yet, but some knife work on edges needed.
Glimmerings of the grain coming through, although it wasn't as highly figured as most.

[dmidkiff]

Lion turned out good. Has a mean look.

[joe]

Excellent thread Scott. Thanks for your efforts.
Regardless of the techniques and materials I'd like to thank all you guys for sharing your experiences.

That's what makes the SB forum so special.

Joe

[scottp55]

Thanks guys....means a lot coming from people with experience! :)
scott

[scottp55]

Bought a couple more and played with the heart/sap line in a piece of 5X24" Cherry, so won't know for a couple weeks of sun how they came out.
Beaver family has 4 days sun.

[Davo]

What happens when it sits in the sun?

[scottp55]

NA Black Cherry heartwood when freshly milled looks almost like Pine.
Heartwood reacts to UV and changes into that beautiful color that antique Cherry pieces reminds us of.
That's unfortunately why a lot of commercial Cherry cabinets/furniture is STAINED "Cherry" :(
Sapwood stays about the same, so contrast really comes into play.
Full color takes years, but direct sun for 1-6 weeks gets it started.
Pics show a short that was on top of my pile in garage and got summer sun, and then machined flat about .03"
Halogen worklamps work well for UV also.
Funniest thing I ever saw was a Cherry dining table done natural, but customer ignored advice and left a lazy susan in the center of their table for 6 months without moving it. First formal dinner and the pale circle was dramatic:)
You can see in the "Beaver Family" that I tried to get the sapwood at the waterline(lower left) to stay pale, with the Beavers changing to dark.
And on St. Basils I left the frame sapwood and carved into the heartwood for contrast.

[scottp55]

Did some more therapy yesterday when it couldn't decide on snowing or raining.
Only piece that was fast to prep and cut was a 1.5" Hard Maple kids block.
I didn't guess correctly how the knot in the end grain ran:(
.9" model, .234" depth, cut with Onsrud .25" 30degree engraving bit with .005"flat at 1,1,18K Offset/Conventional 20% stepover.
I have a Fire Captain showing up tomorrow with her husband for a few hours to go over basic stuff, even if she has an Axiom Pro with spindle, and will use reverse side and teach her tiny tiny fonts and make her do the file and cut it and gift it to her:)
She wants to get into 3D plaques like Rick does.
Fun! Can't wait to carve the other 4 I bought. :)

[Pennywood]

I am a complete novice with cnc, so I had no idea that level of finish detail was possible. Those 3D images are amazing! Forgive my ignorance, but is it difficult to create the file for those images?
Scott, we've had excellent results accelerating the natural darkening process in cherry by using lye mixed with water. The higher the concentration you use, the darker the cherry will get (a 1/4 cup per gallon is a good starting point). Be careful, the initial reaction gets warm, and it's a caustic mixture

[scottp55]

I'd LIKE to claim credit for the files, but that's a whole art in itself.
I only have VCarvePro, so I need to purchase them:)
One guy I've ordered a few times from and been very happy with is Newstyle27 on EBay;
http://www.ebay.com/sch/m.html?item=161912296359&_ssn=27newstyle&rt=nc
There are 3 people I follow now on EBay for when I have a bit of time and looking for something special like these(poor preview pics) I bought recently for some Birds Eye Maple I just prepped.
The Topo of Mt. Desert Island though in Claro Walnut, was made by TPSully in Thingiverse though, and it was free and he made it for me after I asked him if he had ever done that area....NICE guy!
To get that detail though does require smaller bits, and small bits require more time.
Fun though! :)
Looking forward to cutting these new ones.
Thanks for the Tip on Cherry "Aging", but I prefer to let Nature do her thing:)
Thanks!

[Brian Harnett]

For modeling humans this software is great and free. And is easy to use. http://www.makehuman.org/

[scottp55]

Thanks Brian!
Not sure where the heck I would use it, but downloading now to play with it as well as the Blender plug-ins.
Never even used Blender, but Paul Rowntree recommended it for smoothing his original "Topo" program for satellite topographical models which I've gotten into.

[Brian Harnett]

I made this doorknocker for my father with make human Had to be around 2005 it was like version 8 at the time the newer make human has more capability but is a resource hog for my older computer. I have played with blender but not much it does not seem to be an intuitive program, it does import and export a lot of formats. I use wings 3d and sculptris for some modeling.

http://i.imgur.com/NJQQecC.jpg (http://imgur.com/NJQQecC)

http://i.imgur.com/NImUrKF.jpg (http://imgur.com/NImUrKF)

[scottp55]

Thanks for that Brian.
Now I can see playing with it for "Wood Spirits" and maybe a "North Wind Face".
NICE job on that door knocker!
I especially like the flow of the knocker handle.
(NONE of the 3D comes intuitively to me :)