help a pneumatic newbie what do I need for this jig?

[knight_toolworks]

this is a jig I use once a month or more later in the year. the problem is the clamps don't really have much range of throw and even with the wood within .01 or so in width every batch I am screwing with them. Plus they are slow to close and open. so what would I need to replace the clamps with pneumatic calms I only need 1/2" or so of movement.

http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=28847&stc=1

[Keith Larrett]

This not a pneumatic solution, but have you looked into the Kreg automatic brench clamps? They self adjust to the material thickness. I have a couple and they work great.

https://www.kregtool.com/store/c29/bench-clamps/p390/3-bench-clamp/

[Bob Eustace]

Ebay or Ali Express are your friends with pneumatics. You really only need 4 cylinders. Suggest 2" bore by 2" stroke - smaller will work but I know you will find other uses once you get the bug! Below is the cheapest free postage option. This has 1/4 BSP female ports. ($20)

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/SC50mm-x-50mm-0-15-08MPa-Single-Rod-Double-Acting-Pneumatic-Air-Cylinder-/391185206044?hash=item5b14748b1c:g:-wEAAOSw7KJXD1kC

For control you can go solenoid or as a beginner just use a hand 5 port, 2 position valve such as below ($10)

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/5-Port-2-Pos-1-4-PT-Manual-Lever-Actuator-Pneumatic-Hand-Pull-Valve-4H210-08/131758329895?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%2 6asc%3D20140106155344%26meid%3D1b9e057be97a40b9b41 0ff3b6250caa7%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D6%26 sd%3D391185206044

Assume you are cutting one whilst loading the other? If so you need two valves. They are also 1/4". To hook up you just need 5/16" OD plastic tube. You also need male adaptors 1/4" to 5/16 - 8mm. I would buy a few elbows as well and a couple of tees - this stuff is all resuseable. The fittings are brilliant. You just push in and then sharply pull back to lock. This stuff is super cheap. Suggest you try it without an extra regulator as you only need one if it crushes your job.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/5pcs-8mm-OD-Push-In-Tube-to-1-4BSP-Air-Pneumatic-Quick-Fitting-Coupler-Connector-/391193022744?hash=item5b14ebd118:g:CdYAAOSwFMZWryv 2

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Blue-8mm-OD-5mm-ID-5-Meter-16-4Ft-Pneumatic-PU-Air-Tube-Hose-/301198116465?hash=item4620ce8671:g:8cAAAOSwXshWrff f

You can use single acting cylinders but double acting or two way work best. Bet you didnt realise how cheap this stuff is? Now for you next job you could automate your dust gates to open as you turn on the machine!!!!!!!

[Bob Eustace]

Keith I too use the Kregs and have plates in various spots on benches. Great for sanding! With the bot I also use the new in-line self adjusting push clamps from Rockler. Only problem is they are pretty tall when open so collisions can occur! Value for money though you cant go past the Fox cam clamps at $10 from Amazon BUT you do need tee tracks. Air wins though on long run stuff!

[Mark Farris]

Biessy also has self adjusting fixed toggle clamps in most orientations. I use them on a gluing jig that varies 3/8" every other cycle and they work great.

Mark

[knight_toolworks]

Man that big? those things are huge would have to redesign the jig a lot. I cut both at once one it is not practical to change the blocks with the machine in the way. I need the middle for shorter blocks.
the kreig clamps don't look bad though not sure if they would fit. I used to use the cam clamps but they are prone to vibration loosening. for most of the blocks are the same length but there are shorter ones one in them middle and one on the end would be good but for that.

[Bob Eustace]

Cam clamps never work loose if you always go over centre. Very easy to set using tee slots. I also like the way they pull down. Nothing much else does this. For width variation I just pop in a washer! Works a treat. It is possibly your cheapest option for modifying your current jig. Twin inline air cylinders take the least space but are usually under 1" bore with many around 5/8". Mounting though is a breeze with most having a couple of holes down the centre.

[Keith Larrett]

Twin inline air cylinders take the least space but are usually under 1" bore with many around 5/8". Mounting though is a breeze with most having a couple of holes down the centre.

Bob

Could a couple of those twin air cylinders be used to make a pop up fence? Would I just need to get a couple of them and some of those two position valves you mentioned in your first post? I've been wanting to make a an xy fence like the one in this video for ages but am clueless when it comes to pneumatic. (starts at 43 seconds)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YGhVG7Ce0k

(Sorry for the thread hijack!)

[knight_toolworks]

Cam clamps never work loose if you always go over centre. Very easy to set using tee slots. I also like the way they pull down. Nothing much else does this. For width variation I just pop in a washer! Works a treat. It is possibly your cheapest option for modifying your current jig. Twin inline air cylinders take the least space but are usually under 1" bore with many around 5/8". Mounting though is a breeze with most having a couple of holes down the centre.can you send me a link for them? I have the toolpaths for this jig edged so there is no wasted time or movement and the machine just jumps over the jig I also edited out all the z movement that lifts the bit up before each depth plunge.s oI would hate to change the jig. so I get these hollowed 14 of them in 10 minutes but there are a lot of vibrations or a simple bar clamp would work but the vibes loosen them. I have done so many of these I got it down to the min. 45 strips on about 5 hours then I have to flip them over and drill two holes in each.

[Bob Eustace]

Keith they are the same idea and ideal for the fence as per the video. Keeping the stroke short will prevent/minimise crabbing and interestingly the short stroke units are cheaper. I love the way they are the easiest to mount. Only minor drawback is the ports are often very small - around 5mm but there are adaptors readily available to allow tye use of bigger hose. Many ports look like 1/8bsp but arent and the sellers usually are a bit clueless on this. The hand valve in the original reply would be ideal.

[Bob Eustace]

can you send me a link for them? I have the toolpaths for this jig edged so there is no wasted time or movement and the machine just jumps over the jig I also edited out all the z movement that lifts the bit up before each depth plunge.s oI would hate to change the jig. so I get these hollowed 14 of them in 10 minutes but there are a lot of vibrations or a simple bar clamp would work but the vibes loosen them. I have done so many of these I got it down to the min. 45 strips on about 5 hours then I have to flip them over and drill two holes in each.

I would use the ram below to be on the safe side!

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1-37-64-Bore-2-Stroke-Dual-Action-Pneumatic-Cylinder-/301728691768?hash=item46406e7638:g:8gwAAOSw5dNWq0V A

The ram below is the neat twin cylinder unit but the bore is pretty small. To work out force just multiply airline pressure by the total piston area in square inches - this will give you the holding force. It will be a bit low but you can compensate a bit by running a strip of emery along the back face. You would need three rams per side. You cant go wrong with this stuff though as there are multiple uses and you do need a variety of sizes and these prices are crazy cheap but still work really well.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Alloy-Double-shaft-Slide-Guiding-Pneumatic-Air-Cylinder-Jbgyq-/301755586602?hash=item464208d82a:g:iY8AAOSwpzdWq1z r

[bill.young]

I helped a friend set up a clamping system for milling 2x4's for home construction, and we used lay-flat hose that was inflated with air. It was laid between a fixed fence and a sliding sacrificial strip and when pressurized puts even pressure along the length of the 2x4 with very little air pressure. We used solenoids triggered by output switches to inflate and deflate the hose.

It works really well and is pretty cheap and easy to put together....everything came from Amazon or the local hardware store.

Bill28853

[Bob Eustace]

Bill I have been messing with air since age 15 and thats the most brilliant concept I have ever come across and just so cheap! Cant wait to try it! Interestingly most of us probably already have the gear in the shop in tge form of pump up sanders. Just take the valve out.

[knight_toolworks]

I helped a friend set up a clamping system for milling 2x4's for home construction, and we used lay-flat hose that was inflated with air. It was laid between a fixed fence and a sliding sacrificial strip and when pressurized puts even pressure along the length of the 2x4 with very little air pressure. We used solenoids triggered by output switches to inflate and deflate the hose.

It works really well and is pretty cheap and easy to put together....everything came from Amazon or the local hardware store.

Billhttp://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=28853&stc=1
I have had customers use firehose to provide clamping forces. Can you tell me what to get? this should be easy to adapt my jig too. I usually don't reuse jigs just cut them and chuck them when done but this one ends up taking a hour to make each time. so can you tell me what I need?

[bill.young]

Bob...I can't take credit for the idea. It works really well for clamping laminations because it applies even pressure along curves and other funky shapes.

You can get layflat hose in a bunch of sizes from Amazon, and we get short scraps from farmers and aquaculture businesses. Fire companies have to replace their hoses every one in a while and are usually glad to have someone take the old stuff off their hands, but that stuff is pretty heavy and hard to work with. The rest is just assorted plumbing fittings to be able to get air into one end and cap the other one.

If you want to automate the process we've had pretty good luck with solenoid valves like these from Amazon. For this setup for Homebuilt we powered the valves with an external 12v power supply and switched them with output switches using a ShopBot relay board.

https://www.amazon.com/Electric-Solenoid-Replacement-Pipelines-Applications/dp/B00KKIH1YK

[Ajcoholic]

Ive gotten some lengths of used firehose from the local station (for free) in the past as well. We had a kig made to lay up bow limbs (for archery bows) that used an inflatable piece of fire hose. Hardest part is keeping everything air tight.

[knight_toolworks]

got it pretty much done. I got the wrong size end clamps but thats easy to fix.
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