Rhino and VM combo......how do they stack up

[wmcghee]

I went through a demo today with a sales rep and it looked like these 2 programs had alot of features. Just wondering what other users think about them. Ease of use, how they compare to the more expensive programs, learning curve, etc.

I currently just use Partswizard 2 that came with my Alpha. Any info appreciated.

[Brady Watson]

Wayne,
I like Rhino a lot. It is really easy to learn and very powerful. I like the ability to quickly build projects in it to show customers before I even begin on a project...and to see if designs will actually work in the real world. It's good for creating 3D parts, and better at editing existing ones in various formats. Definately a winner.

VM is OK for the Bot user. I know that there are a few VM users on this board that could give you a better assessment than me. I tried the demo, and while it *appeared* to be very powerful, I just couldn't grasp how I had to define regions somehow in 2D, when I wanted to machine a 3D part. It seemed to me that it was more geared towards a CNC metal mill than a CNC router.

There are a number of packages out there depending on what you really want to do. THe 1st being Insignia, which lets you do anything 2D and v-carve anything, plus prismatic letters. You can't do 3D in Insignia, but the interface is identical to PartWizard and ArtCAM...just more tools than PW, so that would be the path of least resistance as far as the learning curve goes.

If you want to do 3D, at $250 MillWizard is hard to beat. Not as many options as VM, but it'll toolpath your 3D file out of Rhino in 5 minutes (an 8yr old could use it!) At $1300, DeskProto offers a lot of capability for machining 3D, including 2-sided milling of true 3D parts and 4th axis machining if you have an indexer. VM offers this too, but to get all of the features it will cost $4k. Then of course, the best do it all and do well package is ArtCAM Pro at about $7500. After you have played with every other package, you really start to see that it is well worth the asking price. It seems as if it were made for the ShopBot.

HTH,
-Brady

[normand]

rhinocam deal ending soon http://www.rhinocam.com/Products/RhinoCAMPro.shtml

[trakwebster]

Can anyone here offer any comparison between using Rhino with MillWizard to generate 3D cutting paths, compared to using Rhino with RhinoCAM *basic* model?

RhinoCAM basic model (about $1000 in October) offers only three toolpath methods (which it describes as 'Horizontal Roughing, Parallell Finishing, and Horizontal Finishing').

Rhino CAM pro (which bumps the price an additional $2000) offers this lot of toolpath methods --
Plunge Roughing,
Horizontal Re-roughing

[paco]

Arthur,

you might want to join this thread (http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13655)...

[hespj]

Arthur, I've had Rhino Cam for a couple of months now, but have not had time to use it much. I have used it enough to think that RhinoCam is far more able than you suspect. A quick look at the RhinoCam menu shows:

2 1/2 axis milling:
Facing
Pocketing
Profiling
Hole Pocketing
Thread Milling
Engraving

3 axis Milling:
Horizontal Roughing
Parallel Finishing
Horizontal Finishing

(There's the option of 4th axis with several options too).

There's also "3 axis hole machining"
Drilling
Tapping
Boring
Reverse Boring

(And 4th axis with the same options).

It can cut out a cavity. It will cut a 3D surface which might include a cavity, or you can isolate a region and tell it to cut inside this region.

The back of a guitar neck would be no problem.

As I say, I've not had time to do much with the software, but I have used it to cut out this jig:


4079


Note that the lighter green regions have been left uncut - the cutting area was defined by a region.

I've also drawn toolpaths for a boat half-hull, but havn't had time to cut it (several hours needed). But this was no problem for it.

Something I don't like is the use of a dongle. I just know I'm going to loose it.

John

[btk]

Arthur,

I would highly recommend RhinoCam if you are a Rhino User, or if you plan on using Rhino. I have used Rhino for a few years and really like it, however others have pointed out that it is might be more difficult to use than the ArtCam Products.

VM/RhinoCam are a great product and MecSoft has great and responsive support (i.e. similiar to shopbot in that they are eager to make their product better and very eager to hear feedback etc.).


I was using RhinoCam Basic which has (3) 3D machining strategies. These strategies are enough to machine any 3 Axis capable object. I purchased a second seat/dongle of RhinoCamPro when that was recently released. I am now taking advantage of some of the more advanced features to optimize machining, however I cut very complex 3D surfaces with RhinoCam Basic.

Parallel Finishing
creates toolpaths that you can configure to either move in the X Direction and Stepover in the Y, or Mov in Y direction and Stepover in the X Direction. You can define the stepover, direction, etc. The toolpaths will follow your 3D Surfaces (i.e. the back of a Guitar Neck).
In Essence, the tool paths end up being in parrallel to each other. (see attached image)

4080
Horizontal Finishing
This strategy creates a series of toolpaths that are each the same horizontal plane. In essence, these toolpaths are used to help define lines where surfaces intersect.


The additional strategies that are available in RhinoCam Pro are there to help optimize cutting.
At the introductory price that was recently available, I highly recommend RhinoCam Pro.
While not all of the kinks are worked out of this initial release, the potential is unbeleivable for the price. Perhaps there is still a discount available if you call them.

I will try to post some more pictures later of the other strategies.

I hope that helps.

Brian

[btk]

Here is an image of the same object with the
Horizontal Finishing.
FYI, very often, Horizontal and Parallel are used together. However if only going to use one, it would most likely be Parallel Finishing.


4081

Incidentally, the other 3D strategy, Horizontal Roughing available in RhinoCam Basic would have removed the brown "stock" that you see in the images.

Brian

[trakwebster]

Gentlemen,

You have been more than kind, and BTK I am particularly grateful for your posting these images.

I'm not yet a Rhino user, but I'm working my way through the demo. My impression so far is that it is a bit faster than building things in TurboCad was.

I've also now installed the RhinoCam module, and I really like the visualization that it provides. It makes it much easier to 'see' what the thing will do. (and with this mock-up by BTK of a guitar neck it is clearer yet!)

It appears that, through October, the price for Rhino and RhinoCAM is $1500 as a special offer.

Although I now have the current TurboCad and TurboCadCam (a 2.5D cam program), it looks like I'll be ahead if I can get the Rhino products for now.

[btk]

Arthur,

Glad the images helped.
That is what is great about RhinoCam.
The tight integration makes it very easy to just do some quick prototyping, etc.

You will find that Rhino has a very active development community, so you can find plugins that do a lot of very helpful things.

I beleive that the $1500 price is the regular price of RhinoCam. It is RhinoCam Pro that is on sale this month ($3000 instead of $4000).

Also with RhinoCam and RhinoCam Pro, you can V-Carve any Font or Vector.


Brian