New Software (Free) - Cabinet Box Cutter

[pfulghum]

The forum has been a great learning experience for me, and it is my turn to give back (it is christmas time)

I have some software that I wrote that I'm willing to share that would help people build cabinet boxes. Shopbots are great at cutting sheets goods.

I got my ShotBot in October.
First project Hickory Kitchen cabinets for my kitchen for Christmas. (But first a vaccuum table more on that later)...

Anyway, I'm a computer geek by trade. I thought it would be "fun" to write something that would help me.

I looked at some of the free and shareware programs out there (CabinetPartsPro, eCabinets, delcam cabinetware, etc)... I was disappointed..

I needed something that would meet MY needs better. So I wrote a program that would...

Given:
a) the definition of some sheet goods
b) the dimensions of my cabinet boxes.

Then let the user define How THEY want to build your cabinets, then with this information.

Generate...
*) a 3D view of a typical box. (this was a lot of fun to write)
*) Generate a part list
*) Generate part labels (on mailing labels to place on the parts as they are cut)
*) Generate Sheet Layout printouts
*) Generate the shopbot files for each sheet that would drill and cut the parts.

This software will run on WinXP and uses the latest technology to build applications.

I don't have a way to distribute the software. Except to email you a zip file. So if you are interested to give it a try, I only ask for one thing in return....

Please give me feedback...

Thanks and enjoy...

-Pat

[pfulghum]

Some Pictures cutting....
4135

[pfulghum]

After cutting and drilling this sheet...


4136

[pfulghum]

Labels on the parts to help the scatter brained....
4137

[bobstand]

Pat, I would like to see what you have put together. Thanks, Bob

[alabama_davo]

Hello Pat,
I would like to see it also, I make cabinets and do it the old copy/paste way...

[dirk]

Hey Pat
I'd like to get a copy.
Dirk

[mrdovey]

Me too!

[den73160]

Pat,

I would like a copy as well.

[steve4460]

Hi Pat

I would like one too .

Thanks .

[Mike Windsor]

Me To please

[tomj]

Hi Pat,

Mind if I give it a try also?

Thanks,

Tom

[holger@fratelli.ee]

Would you mail me a copy as well.

[mikejohn]

Hi! Pat
Any chance of a copy this side of the Atlantic?
Thanks a lot
....................Mike

[pfulghum]

Everyone above this line should have an email.
I would ask that the people above don't give out the install key

-- pat

[paul_n]

Hey Pat...
Man, a feller has to get up early around here to get in line.... Pat, is it to late to see what you have??

- - - - Paul Nielsen

[pfulghum]

A couple of things...I did put a "time-bomb" in the software to not work past Jan 30th 2006. I will post V1.1 before then.

I just really want to get feedback on the program.

And the shopbot files that are generated "drill" with a 5mm Freud cutter and will "cut" with a 1/4" spiral. The cuts are done in about 1/4" depth passes with a final pass taking the final .02" depth and full height to clean things up.

-- pat

[bill_l]

Pat

Looks like I'm a little on the late side but I'd like to give it a try as well.

Bill

[Brady Watson]

Pat,
I would like to give it a try too.

-Brady

[gerald_d]

Pat, will V1.1 also be free?

[pfulghum]

Gerald,
Yes. It will be free.
I just want to incorporate some of the feadback.

By the way...way cool pictures on that "other forum"

[tomj]

Hi Pat,

First, I have to say that I am simply amazed...this program is fantastic! What a time saver!

I have one thing that I ran into is, when I click on "save shopbot part files" nothing happens...did I miss something on the install? Or do you have it set up for proprietary use?

Just thought I'd check and maybe I just missed something. I have only ran through it once with just a test cabinet.

Once again, fantastic! Good job!

Thanks for the trial run of the software!

Tom

[pfulghum]

First "bug" find goes to Tom Johnson...

Bug: When you "Save ShotBot Files" in the layout tab. Nothing seems to happen.

Workaround: Looks like I left development mode on for that part. The files will be saved as XXXLayout.sbp or XXXDrill.sbp in the c:\program files\woodenitbenice\boxcutter directory.

Fix: Later...I will provide a dialog box to select directory to save.

-- pat

[reidcnc@yahoo.com]

Pat
I would like a copy also.
Thanks!

Kevin Reid

[david_morris]

Pat,
I would like review it as well.

[pierre_wessels]

Please send me a copy as well

pierrewessels@hotmail.com (mailto:pierrewessels@hotmail.com)

[cnc_works]

Here's a "me too" post. Do you by any chance have a white beard, big belly and red suit?

donn@cncworks.biz (mailto:donn@cncworks.biz)

[beacon14]

If you have another copy left I'd give it a go.

[bill.young]

Hey Pat,

Have you tried drilling the holes with a 3/16" bit instead of the 5mm bit? It's a little bit smaller which lets you use the CP command with the spiral plunge option to drill the holes. Even that little bit of difference in the sizes gives you some clearance in the hole and seems to make the bit last longer...less friction.

FYI to all, the CP command has been modified recently so that now you can leave the "X center" and "Y center" parameters blank and it will use the current location as the center of the holes.

Bill

[pfulghum]

Bill,

I will take that input and add some software configuration for Version 1.1

The way the shopbot file is created now you can use whatever bit you want. If you want a 1/4" hole, use 1/4" bit, if you want 5mm hole, use 5mm bit.

[ron_moorehead]

I am getting my shopbot in about two weeks so can I try the software out now before I get the Shopbot? If so can you send me a copy. Thanks..

[3d_danny]

Hi Pat,

Another "me too"

Thanks,
Dan

dandunn@bellsouth.net (mailto:dandunn@bellsouth.net)

[richards]

Hi Pat,

I would like to try your software too.

Thanks,

Mike

[dmdraper]

Pat,

I'd like to get a copy of your handywork also. Thank you for sharing it with us.

Dave

[jay]

Hi Pat,

I would also like to try the software.

Thanks,
Jay

[stickman]

Well Guys,

I would sure like to have a look at the software as well.

stickmanwood@hotmail.com (mailto:stickmanwood@hotmail.com)

I think it looks very interesting and might save me some time.

So when you get a chance send me a copy, Please.

Happy to give you feedback, I used to run a cabinet shop for another company.. before I took on the full-time EMT job.

Jay Mack
StickMan WoodWorking

[Towersonline]

I too would like to be added to the list.
Thanks for sharing.

Bill Thorpe

towers@maine.rr.com (mailto:towers@maine.rr.com)

[evan]

I would like to be added to the list also.
Thanks for sharing
Peace

Evan

fxcutting@sbcglobal.net (mailto:fxcutting@sbcglobal.net)

[gerald_d]

Hey Pat, don't send anything to anyone unless you see their pin on this map (http://www.frappr.com/shopbotters).



4138 (http://www.frappr.com/shopbotters)

[carl_vallance]

Please send me a copy to
Thanks for the share

[highpull@gte.net]

another: me too
Thanks

[cabindoors]

Hi Pat,

I would really enjoy trying your program. Thanks and Merry Christmas to you too.

tomjustin@cabindoors.com (mailto:tomjustin@cabindoors.com)

[srwtlc]

Hi Pat,

Here's another me too.

Thanks for the kind offer!

[gus]

Pat,

Yet another me too.

Thanks
tgus@uslink.net (mailto:tgus@uslink.net)

[andyb]

Pat,
Add me too.

abrooks1960@yahoo.com (mailto:abrooks1960@yahoo.com)

Thanks,
Andy B.

[wmcghee]

Pat, I would really like a copy of your program as well.

[pfulghum]

WOW....I didn't realize this would be so popular. I knew I should have charged a dollar.


I can't keep up with the email.

I have had well over 100 downloads of the initial release, but I have only heard from really a handfull of people that have given me *ANY* feedback.

Is it getting installed ok?
Does it run on YOUR machine?
Usefull?
Too Complex?
Way cool?
Do you need metric?

--- UPDATED ---
I did do a small update this weekend and I am releasing Version Alpha2. Those running the first version can update if you want. It has the following fixes:

- Fixed "Save ShopBot Files" to ask the user for directory.
- Users must do a "File New" or "File Open" before interacting with the program.
- Added ReadMe.txt pane

I will be unable to get email during this coming week, but I will have web access to read this forum.

--- GET IT HERE ---
There software is at the very polished and snazy website at http://www.users.qwest.net/~pfulghum/

The installation steps are outlined on that website.

--- COMMON PROBLEMS ---
*) Please be sure to run dxwebsetup.exe (just once) before you run BoxCutter.
*) Also, to start a “project” you will have to do “File…New” from the menu.

Merry Christmas

[kaaboom_99]

Oh my goodness!! Walk away from the forum for a week and miss all the commotion.
Pat, I too would like a copy, but have no plans to date for its use. Am planning a spring cabinet build for the workshop though. Any chance we I could get a copy?
Thanks and have a Merry Christmas.

[bob_lofthouse]

I wish I could make a program like that.

The only problem I could find is that the 3D viewer doesn't seem to work on my machine.

[pfulghum]

Bob/Robert,

I will be gone this week, but I would like to work with you on the 3D after Christmas. Can you send me an email so I can get your email address?

-- pat

[jay]

Robert I to can not seem to get the 3D to work on my machine. thingswood at shaw dot ca

Jay

[stickman]

Pat,

I too was unable to get the 3D viewer to work, but I do like how it optimizes onto other sheets. Can you post some pictures or drawings of your cabinet construction style. It would help me to put into perspective the cabinet parts.

Jay

[richards]

Pat,

The 3D viewer worked great on my machine when I moved the sliders (Windows XP-Pro, AMD processor). Everything else worked too. However, the first time I opened the program and tried to specify the cabinet - upper or lower - they program crashed with a null pointer message (sorry, I didn't write it down). The next time I tried, everything worked perfectly and everything has continued to work perfectly from that point on.

You might consider indenting the labels 1/2-inch or so. (They printed about 1/16-inch from the edge of my paper - standard 8-1/2 x 11 copy paper.)

Also, you might add a spacing dimension between the front shelf holes and the rear shelf holes so that we can adjust the front/back spacing to fit various drawer slides or other 32mm accessories.

I only had a few minutes to play with the program (It's Sunday after all. Between family and church responsibilities there hasn't been much extra time today to try the program out.) BUT, I am extremely impressed with what you've done!

Mike

[heath]

Pat
I am the new guy on the block. I got my bot the day before Thanksgiving. I am very interested in your program if you are still offering.
Thank You
Heath

[richards]

I'm really impressed with Pat's software.

One of the problems that I've always had when I design cabinets using AutoCAD LT is adjusting for the insets and overlays of the sides and back. Sometimes I want the back to be inset with the sides and sometimes I want the back to be flush with the sides. More often than not, I end up with at least one part that I designed wrong. Pat has taken all of that into account. The 3D viewer makes it easy to see how everything fits together. The exploding feature of the 3D viewer shows how the various parts fit together.

One of the features that I like best about the software is having the comment lines in the sbp files giving the part coordinates, i.e.

' Rectangle (0.195, 25.245) (36.505, 48.805) (-0.25)

With that information it's easy to add ramps, change the cut direction, add construction holes, etc.

I haven't actually cut anything yet, but the sbp code looks like it is standard code without any 'gotchas'.

If you cut cabinets, I would highly recommend taking the time to at least look at Pat's program. Just in case you missed Pat's posting of his website, where you can download the program, it's: http://www.users.qwest.net/~pfulghum/

[david_morris]

Pat, I am also impressed with your software development effort and plan on using it on a project soon. I've loaded the new version and delighted with the changes.

Also, you might want to separate the spacing dimension for the front shelf holes and the rear shelf holes so that we can adjust the front/back spacing individually for set back shelving.

Great Christmas present thank you!

[reidcnc@yahoo.com]

Pat

The software looks great, but I also cant see the 3d viewer. Any suggestions?Running windows xp.


Kevin Reid

[pfulghum]

Got the 3D stuff figured out for those of you without a 3D Graphics card...

Thanks go to Jay Pollard and Jay Mack for helping me debug this...

Upgrade (Alpha3) will be posted soon at
http://www.users.qwest.net/~pfulghum/
-- pat

[terry]

Pat,
I like your program!! I draw in e-cabinets for presentation but then have to draw each part in PWizard to cut. Now I can just enter the box size and the cut files are made. This will do everything I need except the following:

a. I need partitions. And of course that means shelves to proper legnth.

b. I inset my backs 1/2" and slide them in a dado. I need to cut the dados for the back.

c. I can't think of anything else!!!!

Man I like this program! Easy to use, all the choices I need for material.

A simple fix for me as far as the partitions is this: Since I use e-cabinets for designing the cabinets it gives me a complete cut list. If you had a tab where you just entered misc. parts with name, cab name, and material, and then it would nest with the rest, that would keep it simple but still easy to enter.

Thanks a bunch for the help and I look forward to your next versions.

Terry

[pfulghum]

Terry,

I like the MISC parts idea....
I think I will just add a Misc Parts Tab where the user can input rectangular parts. And have them saved and layed out with the other parts. I will let the user input an optional description, height, width and material. The parts will just show up in the part list.

I will have to think through the DADO thing. I personally think a full back attached to the sides/top/bottom is MUCH stronger than a dado.

-- pat

[pfulghum]

Terry & others,

I started a new there here....
http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/cgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=29&post=30842#POST30842

To discuss cabinet box construction and why some people prefer a dado.

Please chime in over there.
-- pat

[paul_n]

Pat...
I have downloaded and installed the (ALPHA3), which went fine, but still do -not- have a 3D display.
Has anyone else that did not 3D before, get it fixed with the new version ?

Paul

[bob_lofthouse]

Hi Pat,

I have also downloaded Alpha3 which works fine, but still no 3d display.

Good program though...... many thanks

[paco]

I've been curious too... no 3D neither on my PC (let me know if you need info about this issue; I have the latest alpha 3 release)... I'll let you know about my observations after more testing.

But I can suggest right away more options on the parts layout on sheet good (positionning, start point, cutting order and such).

Thanks for sharing!

[mikejohn]

Once I realised what the sliders did, my 3D worked fine.
.................Mike

[paco]

This is what I got...


4139

[robtown]

Just downloaded and tried, very nice.

How about toe kicks? Either seperate toe kicks or integral?

[pfulghum]

Rob,
No toe kicks...just the box....
I tend to place the box on the seperate kicks during install. On end panels, I put a finished end on the outside of the box.

-- pat

[gerald_d]

Toe kicks, called plinths around here, are of natural wood in case of water spills on the floor.

[pfulghum]

Paco,
I would be glad to work with you offline to get the 3D stuff to work. You should have an email.

Others,
This is the 4th or 5th person that has had trouble with the 3D. Some of the things that have worked is....


1) Goto http://windowsupdate.microsoft.com and make sure that your video driver (and system) is up to date.

2) Try..."Start....Control Panel...Display.....Settings....Advanced...Trouble Shoot..
Make sure that the "Hardware Acceleration slider" is all the way to the right. If you had to move it, a reboot is required.


I'm still struggling with one type of graphics card the Intel 82845G without any dedicated memory.

-- pat

[paul_n]

I am one the guys with the Intel 82845G built in graphics card. By doing 'both' of the steps as posted by Pat, I now have the 3D displayed.
Thanx to -ALL- that helped !!

Nice program, Pat !!

Paul Nielsen

[robtown]

ok then lets add toe kicks to the requested feature list. Seperate or built in, options for both would be best.

[pfulghum]

Perry asks....

Pat, how do I go about getting the files that are required from Microsoft to run your software. My laptop is where I do all my design and as such I have never (nor do I wish to) let it on the net. Are these files downloadable and can the installation of your software be redirected to where they reside on a hard drive?
Thanks Pat. Looking forward to seeing what sounds like a nicely written piece of software.


Pat answers...
You may get ".Net Framework 2.0 Redist" you need a program called dotnetfx.exe (version 2.0) from Microsoft at http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyID=0856EACB-4362-4B0D-8EDD-AAB15C5E04F5&displaylang=en

To get "DirectX December 2005" you need an installer called directx_dec2005_redist.exe try here http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=3F2828FA-0E3C-4837-AFC0-6C67DCAA54BF&displaylang=en


You can put both of those on a cd/memory stick to your non-networked pc

-- pat

[jhicks]

Pat, one more late entry for the demo. Looks like a lot of satisfied users/testers so I can no longer ignore the possibilities.
Please e-mail to me when you finish all the other Christmas presents.
Thanks
jhicks000@ameritech.net (mailto:jhicks000@ameritech.net)

[tonyo@asp-net.com]

Pat, I too would like to try out your program.
Thanks very much and Merry Christmas.
tonyo@asp-net.com (mailto:tonyo@asp-net.com)

[pfulghum]

Tony & Jerry,
Take a look up this forum a bit to find out how to get it....more specifically...

http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/cgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=31&post=30682#POST30682

-- pat

[rpreroes@tampabay.rr.com]

I have problem, I opened the program and tried to specify the cabinet - upper or lower the program crashed with a null pointer message .Any help please

[pfulghum]

Robert,
Are you running the latest software?
I thought I fixed this in version Alpha2

Alpha3 is the most latest.
Get it at... http://www.users.qwest.net/~pfulghum/

-- pat

[Robert Prerovsky (Unregistered Guest)]

yes Im running alpha 3

[terry]

Pat,
I am grateful that you are working on this program. I have been thinking about it a lot recently. What you have now is a very simple program that calculates a basic box and determines dimensions, and places holes, and nests on a sheet, and separates by material, and gives us a graphic rendering of the cabinet, etc. Compared to the high end programs this is simple. However, from my standpoint, what you have already done is very complex. I don't know how to program at all. I am currently drawing my cabinet parts piece by piece in part wizard. Because it's so time consuming I don't place any holes for adjustable shelving and often do my dados later also. This really irks me because I bought the Bot to so it could do all that for me. Now I find that the accurate programming of all that is more time consuming than doing it manually. Not to mention the cost of lost material due to mistakes. So, for me, this program is a breath of fresh air.

I, like a lot of 'botters, use e-cabinets. This program is free, and while still limited in some areas, allows for all of the design of all the parts you need for 99% of all cabinets we are asked to make. Also, it does a nice job of presentation to the customer. It also gives a very accurate cut list for all face frames and all plywood parts of the cabinets, as well as drawer and door sizes. I consider your Box Cutter program to be just what I need to take my cabinets from e-cabinets to the 'bot.

Here's the picture in my mind:
Every thing I need could be done in the "Misc. Parts" section of the program. I would take the print out from e-cabinets and enter the size of each piece. I could then adjust it to what I need. In this case all I need, besides the actual cutting of the piece, is adjustable shelving holes, the dado for the back, and material choice, and of course nesting. Your already have nesting, material choice, and everything we need for hole placement.

The choices we would need for the back dado would be just the "Back Inset". "Depth" might be important sometimes also. "Top Offset" and "Bottom Offset" would rarely be used, but would come in handy from time to time.

Having these all arranged in logical order on the page would be important to reduce error, and you are already doing a nice job on this.

You could take your program as far as you want to go and get as complicated as you want to get. But for a lot of us simple is better. If Box Cutter was able to do what it does now, and then add the Misc Parts area, we would be able to do the vast majority of what we need for building cabinets.

I noticed one post that talked about corner cabinets. There are so many variables on a corner cabinet that to me it would be better to let that be done in Part Wizard. It would really complicate the program.

Well I guess this is my three cents worth this time. Thanks for listening and for the work. I'm willing to help in any way I can so feel free to contact me. This program is really important to me.

Terry

[Shopbot Wanabee (Unregistered Guest)]

Pat: Will any of your future updates include output in G code for us non-shopboters.

[marshawk]

Pat,
I downloaded your software yesterday and love it! It has already saved me money by figuring fewer sheets of plywood for a project than I thought to buy in the first place. You want feedback? Here ya go:

1. The obvious is dadoes and rabbits. It would be nice to have that capacity.

2. The fact that we are able to add material is awesome. I was trying to figure out how to program the top part of a upper and lower bookcase without the bottom, so I inserted a 0 thickness sheet and used it for the bottom. Worked great!

3. A print preview for the sheet layout would be nice to have.

4. The print function from the main menu does not work.

5. Shelves shown as 0 quantity in the "Construction" menu DO actually show up in the "Parts" and "Layout" menus as ordered.

6. I routinely have a blank layout where there should be a cut layout for the backs of the lower cabinets. When I switched the material to 1/4" Mel, it blanked out the first three sheet layouts and moved all of the other cuts down the list.

7. When adding new material, the automatic sizes that come up in the width and length fields are backwards (96"W and 48"L). This makes the sheet layout run the wrong way down the board.

I'll feed back more when I have more to feed back.

Having said all that, I have definitely gotten some good use out of your program! Great job and thanks!

Chip

[evan]

Pat,

Just had a chance to play with your Box Cutter program today. Simple but effective, very nice. Along with the other suggestions of dados, (personally I prefer half blind dados, but that’s a lot more involved than I think you want to get) and rabbits; I think you could cut down on drill time if when you ask for One shelf only five holes are drilled per side, the center hole dividing the interior of the box in two. If two shelves the box would be divided into three equal sections, with a total of ten holes per side. Three shelves and you would drill fifteen holes per side and the box would be divided into four equal sections.
A picture is worth a thousand words…

4140
I think it looks better, a little more high end without all those holes.
I also like Bill Young's suggetion: Have you tried drilling the holes with a 3/16" bit instead of the 5mm bit? It's a little bit smaller which lets you use the CP command with the spiral plunge option to drill the holes. Even that little bit of difference in the sizes gives you some clearance in the hole and seems to make the bit last longer...less friction.
I'm looking forward to the next update
Thank you.

Evan

[bleeth]

Evan: I've always liked rabbits too: White fuzzy ones are fun and fat brown ones taste good. In my casework though I am partial to dados and rabbets.



Dave

[pfulghum]

Evan,
Interesting suggestion, I'm trying to keep the program simple to use. I will try and come up with something. I like the holes all the way up. I use those holes for my hinges and shelf pins. Those holes are also used for drawer runners. I really like the "Blum Process 32"

I REALLY SUGGEST that if you do cabinets you check out the "Blum Process 32 Manual". Google says it is here...

http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/Blums_Process_32_Manual_PDF.html

-- Pat

p.s. as far as dados and rabbits...Too much trouble for me...and they really don't taste that well.

[jim_hansen]

Pat I too would like to try your program and I thank you for all your work. Jim

[stickman]

Pat,

The "Blum Process 32" is a really good cabinet program and for those of you that haven't read about it, I encourage you to look into it.

Though the 32mm system can be done in a number of ways, it has the same principal each time. You can start with a cabinet that is two doors, change it to a two drawer, to door cabinet, or even to a drawer bank and you have used the same sides.

On Evan's example of 32mm construction, that works really well, if you want shelves that don't run into the hinge mounting plates. It has good reasoning as well. The downside, you have to drill holes for the hardware.

I am looking forward to working more with the program.

Jay

[gerald_d]

How do you guys pronounce rabbet? Same as rabbit?

On this side of the Atlantic, we use rebates....and they don't rhyme with rabbit. You guys couldn't spell rebate.

[beacon14]

We spell rebate all the time - that's what manufacturers tempt us with to get us to buy their products.

We pronounce rabbet just like rabbit.

[evan]

The White Rabbit offered a rebate on all rabbets but Alice would have none of it having saw the route of the lost Da Do bird. best I could do on short notice…and I never said I could spell

Yes, it’s true you have to drill separate holes for hinges and drawer slides, but I think it look less like mass produced cabinets, more custom. I also put the shelf pin holes back a little further from the edge than the hinge plate holes. It’s also true that you would need to take into account hinge placement with shelf placement, so I can see why it’s easier to program your method over mine.
It’s a matter of aesthetics.

[beacon14]

By the way, I'm told rabbit can be prepared medium or well, but rabbets should always be well done.

[woodguy60]

Hi pat can i also get a copy thanks

[pfulghum]

Woodguy...
Download it from...

http://www.users.qwest.net/~pfulghum/