Box Cutter (Alpha Version) Expiring.

[pfulghum]

The current version of BoxCutter will expire on Jan 31, 2006. I've been VERY busy doing my own cabinets and kitchen remodel. (I will post pictures sometime). I personally have built roughly 30+ boxes using this software. I never released the "raised panel calculations" part of the program.

I need to decide what I am going to do with this software.

I'm not willing to give away the RIGHTS to the intelectual property contained in the program. That is why you "license" software and not "purchase" software. I have spent untold hours building this program and it seems to be of use to a few folks. That week in December when the Alpha versions were released, I did spend quite a bit of time talking to people.

I'm in a quandry....Do I ...

A) Sell this thing the way it is for a modest fee? Is so how much $$? This implies some sort of support (time) on my part.
B) Do I release it as a "Free Version" the way it is without support?

I would like your input. Please give me some feedback by answering the following questions.

1) Would you buy this program in its current form?
2) Do you need some enhancements before you would by it?
3) How much would you be willing to pay for it?

Based on this feedback, I will decide what to do.

-- pat

[cabindoors]

Hi Pat,

I am very interested in your program and you've done a very nice job on it. I know that your programming hours are tremendous. (My BSEE and BSCE may suggest my on-campus computer room hours - do you remember FORTRAN and punch cards?).

If I were the developer I would probably charge up to $100 for the program (in it's present state) and probably $500 or more if you've included the improvements I've listed below. With a few improvements you could stop using the term "box cutter" and start using "Cabinet Making". That would help alot particularly in sales!

I do feel however, Pat, that you do have some obligation to the buyers that got you off the ground and into the lucritive world of cabinet making software. You may want to (as an incentive) provide them with free upgrades for a period of time say, the first year.

Also, if I may be so bold as to suggest some improvements.

Because of the way we hold down each piece (edge clamps) I would need to vary the layout alittle to ensure the bit doesn't hit the clamps on the outside edges of the sheet goods. Also talking to my cabinet-maker brother, to be a viable program for us, we would definately need dado, rabbit, and toe-kick capabilities.

I look forward to hearing from you and seeing your "raised-panel" door program.

I hope that this helps alittle. I think that you may become rich with these efforts. At least I hope so.

Tom

[richards]

Pat,

Life's too short to waste time trying to sell software. If you enjoy writing software as much as I do, have some fun. Write the best code that you can and then give it away. You'll never be rich, but you'll sleep well at night.

On a more serious note, cabinet software can get complex. There are so many variations possible just designing for the 32mm system that writing something that follows all known standards would take many man-years. Adding the capability to do face frame cabinets would easily multiply the complexity by a factor of two or three.

I've been playing with cabinet code since last summer when Bruce Clark and I released a fairly stable version of the doors program. My conclusion is that I could never spend the time necessary to write a user friendly version with all of the features that cabinet makers would expect and still release it under the open source license. Going the commercial route and selling the software and actually making a profit with it would put it in the $7,500 to $12,000 range where it would have to compete with other excellent software. The drawback to that approach is that eCabinet Software, which is very good, is free to anyone (even if it only produces code for Thermwood routers). But the reality is that if someone were in the business of making a living doing cabinets, the $80,000 for a turnkey cabinet model Thermwood could be justified to almost any banker. Even the $50,000 ball-park figure for a Shopbot with tool-change spindle, heavy-duty vacuum system, KCDw software, and other bells and whistles is about the minimum dollar amount that I would expect to pay for a ready-to-run cabinet system. Anyone buying that kind of system would and should expect complex software that keeps the CNC router cutting all of the time.

My personal belief is that unless you have a product with all of the features of the mid to high priced software, it's better to give away the more basic versions rather than compete with other companies that sell modestly priced packages. Trying to sell on volume to a market as small as the Shopbot community doesn't look viable. Granted, there might be 4,000 potential customers, but even if every one of them bought software with a $500 price tag, and even if you netted $250 per package after subtracting marketing, production costs and basic support, could you afford to hire the people to do all of the necessary handholding that would be required to teach new users how to use the machine and then how to use your software? Believe me, you'll find that points and procedures that seem perfectly logical to the programmer will bring you endless phone calls and emails. (I'm not complaining because I actually enjoy talking with fellow Shopbotters and answering their emails; however, if I were trying to run a software business, someone would have to cover those costs.)

-Mike

[richards]

Pat,

After reading my previous post, I realize that I might have been a little too pessimistic. You have a fine program that does a lot. My post was not a complaint about your software or anyone's software, it was just my views about the difficulty of making a living selling software when the potential customers are all, by nature, do-it-yourselfers.

Have you thought about running a software service where you provide customers with a front end program where they can design/specify types, sizes and quantity, and then you rent/license/sell the cut files using ProjectWizard or other software rental type service?

-Mike

[cabindoors]

Hi Pat,

I still think that for us that want to build a few cabinets, your program would be worth it. Don't get discouraged. Let people download your program and cut a few cabinets. Once they find that it works and they are satisfied that's all that matters.

I don't agree with Mike when he says just give it away - you'll sleep at night. That doesn't pay any bills.

I once had an old cowboy say to me "I'd rather do nothin for nothin than work for nothin".

Good Luck.

Tom

[pfulghum]

Judging by the low traffic, I don't think many people are activly using the software.

If you are in need of a fix for the "timebomb" aplease drop me an email, or post here. I check regularly.

-- pat

[zeykr]

Pat,
I got your software and have played with it but have not yet used it to cut anything yet. I see a future need to do a few cabinents for personal use and always looking for new ways to use the equipment so was interested. Nice looking software and do hope to get time to try it out in future.

[rpreroes@tampabay.rr.com]

hi,Pat can you send me fix for time bomb im using you software and i liked it. thank you

[stickman]

Pat,

I haven't had a use for it yet. I have looked at your program and I really do like it. I will send you an e-mail for the fix. So when I do have a job that I can use it on, I will try it in full force.

As for money, let me in on a little of my situation. I have gave my maltese cross drawings and the shopbot code as well. I only ask for money if they start to make exceeding amounts of money with it. I've always give it up to others in the "spirit of the forum"