Need advice on sign project

[ttwark]

We are using VCarvePro to make a sign for a community project (hoping for exposure for our company). Sign is 4'x 7'. All we ever work in, is wood. Could 1/2" PVC foam hold up mounted on a brick baseball dugout wall at a public school. Also, what paint is recommended for this material? Can I carve, then paint areas, then sand over surfact to give sign finished look? Thanks for any suggestions

[Brady Watson]

Tom,
PVC is great for adding vinyl and screen printed logos etc, but it really is not very nice for carved signs. I am assuming that you are referring to Sintra or Komotex/Celtec etc. They are essentially PVC foams and while they have a smooth surface, the interior is a bit sandy. Plus, when you clear out an area or v-carve it, the results are less than ideal. To top it off, very few adhesives reliably stick to it, and a 4X7X0.5" piece has about as much rigidity as a flounder...

If you want to save yourself a lot of headaches, buy a sheet of Duna signfoam. It's cheaper & better than the leading brand (Signfoam III) and you can carve & sandblast it at will (or apply a VCP backgound texture to it) It readily accepts just about any type of paint and is pretty durable. You'd do best to apply an exterior plywood backer to give it some strength, and a reliable way to mount it. I would personally use MDO (RTG from Harbor Sales) and seal the edges really well....but that's just me.

-B

[ttwark]

Thanks, I'll look into Duna - we've read about it but haven't found a supplier for it yet. I'm thinking we just need to go ahead and get some and try this product out.

[joe]

Tom,

I have a couple of suggestion for your consideration.

If the Dough-Out sign can be handled by the public, I'd porbably use a tougher material than HDU.

Your first idea to use PVC seems good to me. Like Brady say, 1/2" stock may flex a little but if secured to the wall with good fixtures it should do well. We use quiet a bit of 3/4" PVC and that will stay very flat. I think we pay about $160 per sheet. Some batches arrive at our shop with a glass smooth surface. The 1/2" usually has a flat, low gloss sheen.

Painting PVC:

This material takes lots of different type paint. I would suggest you begin by masking the complete sign panel with a temporary vinyl, called pre-mask. Carve your copy and paint with latex. If you are going with a white background, this will go very fast however if the background is to be painted it will take some surface prep and drying time.

Good luck and let us know how you do.

Joe
www.normansignco.com (http://www.normansignco.com)

[ttwark]

We are wanting to cut a project out of something that isn't wood so bad I think we're going to invest in a couple of the products you've discussed and make something, anything, so we'll have some experience in handling these materials. If we wait til we have a "real" job to try them we could get ourselves in trouble, and we really want to use our ShopBot in this way to hopefully generate some quicker turnaround jobs as a lot of our main projects (which are all wood) tend to be larger, longterm projects. Will keep reading the ShopBot sign section for more advice

[ed_lang]

Tom,

Be sure to bring pictures or samples of what you cut, wood or other to the Camp on September 8th!

The scrapbook you showed me when we first met would also be a great thing to bring!

Your work is outstanding to say the least!

Everyone will want to see them!

[jhicks]

Tom, you have a wide range of materials to choose from to develop routed and dimensional signs. The fun part is combining materials, design elements,fabrication and finishing techniques.
As you start your research and experimentation you might want to be on the look out for some of these.
PVC/Komatex/Celtec sheet products. We think they have their place and produce nice details with a good paint finish IF you prep and finish with right materials.

SINTRA... branded PVC but in thin sheets so easy to cut shapes, letters, and laminate in colored layers. Best for interior or paint for exterior.

Acrylics / Plexiglass. Nice finished, colors etc. Makes good letter stock and base board with colored / layered dimensional stuff.

Color Core and their competitors. Cool to cut, no paint, and nice 2 color dimensional routing look but premium, material cost. In HDU range but no painting.

Medex sheet goods also work with epoxy or polyurethane finish. Some like extira better but each have to be properly preped and finished to hold up.
Colored MDF is available in some areas and an interesting look for certain interior uses.

HDU Fantastic to work with, pricey and often need mechanical support or back board stiffeners but nice stuff. Again prep and finish are key.

Di Bond, gator foam,Ultra Foam. Paper, plastic surface or Metalized finishes in aluminum on foam or plastic core. Cool stuff in silver, gold, and several colors. Nice to cut and layer, useful for letters and logos, or as backboard in combination with any of above materials.

Once you get your hands and eyes on these, the next step is fabrication and finishing strategy. The real key to sign fabrication is what to do when (sequencing the build and finishing steps)and what materials to use on the finish details.

Keep your eyes open and meet with material suppliers for many more brands and materials. New stuff is being introduced all the time but these are all viable materials to become familiar with and useful in one application or another. Suppliers are pretty generous with samples and specifications and application notes so I would suggest you start your material library and keep adding to it as you see or read about new ones.

Good luck and have fun experimenting.

If I were making baseball dug out signs that needed to be painted, I would use PVC sheet in 3/4" thickness. Sells here for about $95.00/ 4x8 sheet. Get some design ideas, some paint mask, and lightly sand the pvc sheet. Paint the base background color after light scuff sanding, mask and wax the mask, carve the design, and paint the carved elements with color(s) of choice.
Strip mask gently off and if any more maybe a clear coat finish.
Test paint on samples first but we have seen folks use exterior acrylic latex, spray can enamels, and catalyzed finishes all pretty successfully and each have their own prefered approach.

When mounting, leave room in the screw or bolt hole for expansion and contraction and don't torque it down too tight.

PLAY BALL!