Am I Still "Hand Crafting"

[aaron]

We sell custom built furniture and have always pushed that our furniture is hand crafted in the USA. I recently started CNC cutting some of my basic pieces and just got to thinking last night "am I still handcrafting"? Am I misleading my customers now? We still hand assemble, hand sand, tweak, tune, etc but- at what point are things no longer hand crafted? Does handcrafted mean no CNC? Or just not made on a giant assembly line? Do you think I need to change my advertising now?

Thanks!
Aaron

[jseiler]

Hence a new term....hand finished.

[jamesgilliam]

Aaron, I would say no, you don't need to change what you are saying about it being hand crafted. With the amount of hand work you are doing I do not think anyone would complain about it, especially if you were using power tools to make some of the parts before going CNC. While the Bot will turn out the parts the same way every time, the craftsmanship still lies in the rest of the process. Just think of the machine as a tool. If someone really wanted to go to the farthest limits of the term "handcrafted", I would say that had to start from the begining, cutting the tree down with an ax, the roughing of the planks with a hand saw, and going all the way to the final finish. Just my opinion.

[wberminio]

Aaron

Do you cut-drill-sand with your fingernails?
Do assemble your joints by pounding your fists?

CNC tools are TOOLS.Just as are your electric saws and drills.

I think many of us have struggled with your dilemma--Until the mailman arrives with this month's bills


Believe me,If Stradivarius had a Shopbot,he would have used it and still would have created his
musical marvels.

Erminio

[dana_swift]

I too have pondered the "hand made" claim, as even when I used power tools and fixtures to hold everything in place (pre bot days) the tools were constrained to make the cuts correctly. I didn't just hand hold saws, drills, etc.

I used to use a router table with patterns and special tooling to make my parts. Now the gantry holds the router, and moves it in a pre-defined motion. Yet things clearly are not the same anymore.

I do cut many of my own trees, dry the wood, re saw it etc. I use a chainsaw and a band saw. Is that cheating? I move the wood with a pickup and a trailer. Should I have carried it on my shoulder? My shoulders aren't what they used to be, and I don't think they were ever up to carrying a 20' x 40" tree trunk. Certainly not now.

Is it only "hand made" when the power tools are hand-held? Maybe that is where the difference is. Hand finished or hand assembled, those still apply. Perhaps I should refer to my work as "precision cut - hand assembled"! I kind of like that..

Now I have become a weaselly wordcrafter also... Should I run for office?

D

[bcammack]

re: "hand finished"

I remember back in the late '60s when we were driving out from Anchorage, Alaska to Los Angeles on our annual 10k mile round-trip. We stopped for breakfast in the middle of nowhere in the Yukon Territory at a tiny, rustic roadside cafe beside the narrow gravel highway.

Upon opening the breakfast menu, the entry "freshly poured orange juice" caught my eye. We were, of course, at least six or seven thousand miles from the nearest orange grove. Everything came up the Alcan in cans then.

I still chuckle when I consider the nuance of that entry...

[gerryv]

Aaron,

Some years ago, before the NAFTA agreement, I believe that the rule of thumb for "made in Canada" of "made in USA" required 50+% content (including labour I believe). While this is a different scenario, I'd think that the same principle would/should/could provide some guidance on this question.

[paco]

Aaron, you do use your keyboard and mouse to create files and toolpaths, right?... or at least a voice recognition system of any kind.

Even C-3PO has hands...

Seriously, it's an eternal debate. If you think that "Hand made" isn't appropriate anymore, then "Robot made" may not be better.

[dray]

If you have to ask then the answer is no.


When I do that I am usually searching for the answer that I want lol

[harryball]

The way I look at it... Hand Made means that the cuts, shaping etc... were guided by human flesh and bone. This lets the inconsistencies and flaws of human craftsmanship come through. No two pieces alike and all. Those hands can be holding chisels, power tools or pushing material through power tools but THEY are guiding the shaping.

I personally would be disappointed to buy a "hand made" table or whatever and find out the parts were cut on a CNC. Hand Assembled and Finished might be more appropriate. However, cutting sub components of an item but not the primary creative component might be described with more detail. For example, if I made a table frame on the bot but then hand made table tops for the same frame I might say "Hand Made and Finished custom table top tables" or some such.

/RB

[butch]

Aaron
This may not fit your scenario, but I use "Locally Made" or “Locally Manufactured”. In this little part of the world I sell in, that insinuates that it is “Hand Made”. Around here it is a big selling point to have something made locally, by local craftsman.
Butch

[Gary Campbell]

Guys...
One more factor.... In a way I consider our products "hand made using traditional methods and the most modern equipment"

I would like to think that a one of a kind product made locally is easily distinguished from a mass produced, mass marketed product.

Even tho we may use the same machines as a factory, we hand select each piece, have hands on each piece as it is jointed, glued, cut, shaped, sanded, finished and even placed on our CNC for machining. There are no conveyor belts, no one purpose employees(specialists in the marketing world, trained to do one operation in mine) or the associated need to keep up with a production schedule that has been set in an office somewhere.

No automatic staightline saws, just craftsmen using their eyeballs and fingers. No robotic sprayers..... you know the rest. The main difference is there are no production shortcuts or deadlines. We use the CNC to increase the accuracy of our cuts and drilling locations. We also use it to get consistancy and repeatablilty. In short, we can increase quality and decrease cost.

In this day and age of outsourced cheapo products, I think that we all can, and should, use the term "HAND MADE"
Gary

[beacon14]

I kind of like "Custom Made", i.e., made-to-order as opposed to mass-produced.

David Buchsbaum
Beacon Custom Woodwork

[dray]

Custom made.. Is the way to go.

[wberminio]

I agree -Custom Made covers it all!

[kerrazy]

I am in agreement with R. Ball, in regards to my own interpretation of hand crafted. It really literally is a touchy feely issue for me, and I too struggled with this dilemma. I have on occasion been overwhelmed with guilt as I idly type away on my computer on some chat forum, while a machine is cutting my fancy prismatic letters. There is a very reputable lad, across town who would do an equal if not nicer job by hand, and I do feel like a poser.
To overcome this guilt, I have been known to break out my chisels and rasps, just to be sure I can really do it by hand.
I might suggested custom crafted, as it will still lend itself to your unique situation.

[Gary Campbell]

I agree with David B. and those following. We do use the "custom" description in our advertising and website.

Point to ponder: Where is the line drawn? If I want to make a shaker style 5 piece door, I have the following options: Router plane (unused from my grandfather), router with style & rail bit set, router table with bit set, shaper with appropriate bits, or the shaper with power feeder and appropriate bits. Does hand crafted end when the electric cord is plugged in? Does Dale's hand carver possibly rough out his stock with a power tool?

The man I apprenticed under spent the 1st 2 years of his apprenticeship pushing a hand scraper over an 8 by 16' conference table.

Just stirring the pot, Gary

[aaron]

Thank you all for your input! I guess the hand crafted term probably gets a little diluted every generation as new technology is introduced. What used to mean cutting down the tree with an axe & shaping with a hand chisel can now include power tools and, maybe, even CNC machines. I guess the whole point here is trying to separate my work from the imported junk & less about what tool I actually use to built the final product.

I really like "Custom Made" and we may end up changing to that if I start to loose sleep over the "Hand Crafted" label.


Thanks again,
Aaron

[coach]

This is out of "The complete Idiots Guide To Guerrilla Marketing."
This is out of the book work for word.....
"Under the Federal Trade Commissions Act, advertising of any kind must be truthful and non-deceptive. You must have evidence to back up your claim and you cannot mislead customers in any way, either by false statements or omissions of relevant information."
I also like "custom made."

[dray]

Honesty is always the best policy.

[servant74]

I like the idea of honesty first. If you get a 'twinge' telling a customer something, then you need to re-think what you said.

I like the 'Custom Made', if it is ordered before manufacture or at least assembly and finishing.

Crafted With Care - could be another moniker that could be totally true as long as you do some hand work (even a great inspection would qualify).

[harryball]

If you lie and you happily ignore the "twinge" perhaps you should be an investment banker.

If you lie and do not get a "twinge" at all then you may be a lawyer.

If you can no longer tell if you are lying even when someone else points it out... politician.

Sorry, couldn't resists.

Honesty seems such a simple policy and you always hear it is the best. But it is hard to believe it's best when you get beat up by someone else in your business who is distorting the truth. In those cases, be honest and out last them. Their dishonesty and shades of gray truth will catch up with them. We used to have a competitor for 2 years that made promises, mistated facts, over stated capacities etc... I can no longer find them online or otherwise. Hang in there long enough to outlast them without becoming them.

/RB

[tmerrill]

I like "Custom Made" for advertising and business cards.

But I engrave everything I make using "Craftsmanship by" to get by the "Hand Made" issues. It seems to impress customers. I have two versions, one with the year and one without.

Tim


6923

[chiloquinruss]

I always thought if I got 'blood' on a part, then it was 'hand made'!
Russ

[mitch_prest]

I certainly hope bleeding on it is not the final decision to make it hand crafted.. though it does happen..
I think that people will have to decide for themselves.. but things can still be handcrafted that come off a CNC. I just put together a couple of japanese saw horses.. .. yes I cut the parts for them on my bot.. but I also cut down the trees and milled the wood. I then cut the mortices and tenons that were roughed out by CNC. I made wedges by hand as there is no glue and no nails involved. Even though it all passed by a modern machine.. does that make it any less of a handmade piece.. to me they are handcrafted and I would no problem advertising that way.
Back to the original posters question.. if he is making custom furniture, is he not having to design the pieces and draws the parts to be cut out.. all this being done by someone skilled with their hands...from the dictionary

Etymology: Middle English handi-crafte, alteration of handcraft
Date: 13th century
1 a: manual skill b: an occupation requiring
skill with the hands
mitch

[chiloquinruss]

Seriously, I no longer use a brace and bit to drill holes, I haven't used a draw knife in many years, the final pass when sharpening my tools is still done by hand but the others . . my screwdriver comes with batteries, my planner is plugged in, my sander is also, but my product looks, feels, smells, the same as before. How is it that it is no longer hand made, because of the tools? I don't think so. I have seen products that were 100% produced by machines, to date I have seen very few items produced in any kind of wood shop that falls into that category. Wood by its very nature cannot and will not submit to unwatched tooling. It must be gently persuaded to become something else. As others have stated a ShopBot while amazing is just a tool! The hand made part is made by a person using their hands and that tool or tools. That's my story and I'm stickin' to it!
Russ

[myxpykalix]

I think we're getting too hung up on the term "handmade". Unless you go back to doing it they way they did 200 years ago there is going to be tools involved and we have evolved many of those tools to be run on electricity instead of elbow grease and since my joints have run out of grease, its a good thing.

I don't think most people feel slighted because a tool helped make a piece.
A good example is here where i have to have a tree cut down in my yard. I don't want the guy chopping it down like Paul Bunyan with a broadax but it can be done faster, safer and easier with a chainsaw.

Now if i wanted someone to take that log and hand carve a wooden indian then i am expecting him to use his artistic creative ability to create his work much like a painter would and i wouldn't consider that the same as if he made a 3d model of the indian and carved it on the bot.

After i just read what i wrote, i got to thinking about it and now i am confused, so in the end it is probably best left up to individual interpretation.

[bcammack]

"A good example is here where i have to have a tree cut down in my yard. I don't want the guy chopping it down like Paul Bunyan with a broadax but it can be done faster, safer and easier with a chainsaw."

Jack,

I want him to chew it down like a beaver. Hey, if I'm paying good money...

[myxpykalix]

Brett
You know in the past I learned that when you price your work or quote a job, don't let your client know that maybe it only takes an hour to create a file and cut it or they will assign a value to only that hour of work and not want to pay what you think your education/experience/material/tools are worth for creating what they want.
OH NO...I hope i didn't create another aspect of this handcrafting thread we can argue over! lol

[waynelocke]

There is an excellent book on this subject by David Pye, The Nature and Art of Workmanship, published in 1968 and still available. He argues that handmade and other such phrases no longer apply and basically categorizes workmanship as either "workmanship of risk" or workmanship of certainty".

" If I must ascribe a meaning to the word craftsmanship, I shall say as a first approximation that it means simply workmanship using any kind of technique or apparatus, in which the quality of the result is not predetermined, but depends on the judgement, dexterity and care which the maker exercises as he works. The essential idea is that the quality of the result is continually at risk during the process of making; and so I shall call this kind of workmanship 'The Workmanship of Risk': an uncouth phrase, but at least descriptive.
...
With the workmanship of risk we may contrast the workmanship of certainty, always to be found in quantity production and found in its pure state in full automation. In workmanship of this sort the quality of the result is exactly predetermined."

Pye's ideas always made sense to me.