Flat pack projects

[therechris]

I was wondering if anyone has any "flat pack" files they'd like to share. Anything like animals to furniture would be great, just looking for things I can do in a half sheet as I have a prt 4x4. Also any adirondack chair or ottoman files. Thanks for all your help.

[kelly]

Hi Theresa, this is a file I found on CNCZone. I cut it on my Buddy 32 using a 3/4 birch ply. I was able to get two horses from a 4x8 sheet of ply (24x32 sections = 3 sections per horse) The design needs some tweaking and tuning (Hoping to make the mods this weekend) but it's a solid design with some great ideas to work from. I plan to modify the "Rocker" with some brakes as I am worried the horse could flip if my great nephew really gets to rocking

I am also working on a doll cradle design using the same concepts. (No fastners, stores flat nested on sheet goods, etc.) I will post both modified files with some photos when I get them done. The design would really be enhanced with some engraving and I am working on being able to flip the head and tail so I can put eyes,texture, mane, etc. on both sides. I think I have a solution but I wont know until I get it on the bot. If it works I will post photos.
There are a number of projects on CNCZone that would be "flat plack" but if your looking for projects to sell you will need to do homework on ownership and such. Look for the Dino Font thread for a link to CNCZone. (You will need to reg on the site to have access)
Be well,
K.Z.


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Rocking Horse DXF
rocking horse.zip (http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/messages/312/rocking_horse-34701.zip) (23.6 k)

[therechris]

Kelly, when you down load these how are you knowing what size bit to use or does it matter since you are cutting a profile?

[dana_swift]

Theresa, the only thing a bigger bit does is make more dust and leave bigger radius's in the corners.

If you get too small of a bit, it wont have a long enough clear cutting edge to penetrate the material thickness. I try to use the smallest bit that will go all the way through the material, that makes the smallest kerf, the least dust, and the sharpest inside corners.

Hope that makes sense-

D

[kelly]

I have been using trial and error. -Mostly error
- It really depends on the material, thickness, and what kind of finish you need.
I have been happy with the results from my 1/4 and 3/8 straight bits. (CMT & Whiteside)
The Dino projects seem to require a lot of mods to get right. The rocking horse was cut with a 3/8 straight but I suspect I would get a better edge with a spiral.
Hope this helps,
K.Z.

[landdesign]

holy rocking horse... my horse show up again!... I Posted it on cnc zone 6 months ago and have picks from people as far away as Germany cutting it for their grand kids.... glad to see people are have fun using it for Personal use



Erik

[kelly]

Hi Erik, you need to make sure you name gets into the file.
I was doing a search to find the designer to thank them. So,ummm... - Thank you!
My Great Nephew is going to love it.
Great design and the measurements included in the file are a big help.
Be well,
K.Z.

[landdesign]

Your welcome.... and no problem... I have fun deigning this kind of stuff. I have a pile of files that I dough will ever get cut full scale. its more of a mental exercise than anything. I have started embedding my name in the files lately... wish I had done it sooner... HA!

Erik

[landdesign]

Your welcome.... and no problem... I have fun deigning this kind of stuff. I have a pile of files that I doubt will ever get cut full scale. its more of a mental exercise than anything. I have started embedding my name in the files lately... wish I had done it sooner... HA!

Erik

[dray]

Radius shelves, unfinished. Gave me a headache lol




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[zorlack]

I've also been playing with some flatpack design lately. Mostly just to learn about the pitfalls and mistakes that I make.

My first project was a very uncomfortable chair (http://flickr.com/photos/zorlack/sets/72157607524199000/). I learned a bit about making chairs. Mainly that what looks tall in autocad might turn out looking pretty squat in real life. Oops.

A fellow flickrer turned me on to a useful plywood joinery technique (http://www.flickr.com/photos/edtillman/2890857579/) to help me with future flatpack-ish projects. I'm going to try it on the next go around.

Right now I'm designing a book case (http://www.flickr.com/photos/zorlack/2918639691/). The biggest challenge that I see with my book case is concealing the plywood edges. Maybe I shouldn't even care... A sharp bit on some good ply will produce a nice edge...

If the bookcase comes out nicely I'll post the parts.

-Z

[dray]

ok, I finished the shelves. Got a headache~!!
You will have to resize. BTW there are an extra set of middle pieces that need to be deleted.



7288 (47.6 k)

I cut some in MDF. Can you see im bored?


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[gabepari]

Dave,

Very cool stuff. I love this kind of fabrication. I've build a few bunk beds for my kids. It's a great way to learn and find design flaws and gems alike.

Gabe

[dray]

top view

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[gabepari]

Danny,

We must have visited the same website, I just finished up a 3d rendering of that exact same design a few days ago. I've seen these in various places on the web, they are extremely simple and cool.


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Gabe

[therechris]

These a great designs files. I thought it would be a neat way for me to start on the shopbot and really figure it out

[dray]

I had to manually draw it in cad lol!

Because I didn't know the mathematics behind slicing a 3d sphere.

Someday I'll learn a 3d cad program

[gabepari]

Danny, it's easier to draw manually in 2d cad (Once you figure out what's really going on
)

I just do the 3d to show the guys at the shop what it will look like without having to actually build one.

Gabe

[landdesign]

Dave don't worry about the plywood showing. I cut flat pack stuff every day and it's very seldom someone asks about the plywood edge. if it dose bother you maybe try something like Apple Ply and make the edge a focal point of your project.

oh... and great job on the bookcase. it will look great when its done.

Erik

[zorlack]

Thanks Gabe and Erik,

I'm definitely over-sensitive to the edge. That stems mostly from the fact that for theater scenery/furniture I use cheep-o plywood.

What's the best way to prep plywood edges for paint. For this project I'm not sure yet what I'm going to do. Because I'm new to this I've never worked with edge banding. I was thinking of giving that a shot.

-D

[Gary Campbell]

Dave..
Edge banding will work well. You can buy it preglued and apply it with a cheap iron. Covers a lot of sins. Look at the speed roller and quad trimmer from Fast Cap. Not the cheapest tools, but good.
Gary

[jamesgilliam]

Ok what am I missing here? I downloaded the shelves.dxf to look at and my computer is saving them as an unk file. None of the programs I have see it.

[beacon14]

change the file name extension from .unk to .dxf

[therechris]

Ok, Maybe I'm too green. How do you cut this shelf? Do you cut all the horizontal pieces out of on sheet and the vertical out of another? Just wondering if someone could show, maybe highlight what is 1st and then second cut? I love the design.

[dana_swift]

Theresa, part of the fun of building stuff is figuring out how to use every square inch of the raw material. Arrange the parts so it uses the absolute minimum wood, you can flip curves over so they nest next to each other leaving only the width of the bit (+ a hair) between them.

Every once in a while I see something interesting like that and look at my scrap bin and wonder if I can squeeze another project out of it for "nothing".

Green turns into "green thumb" quickly with experience when what you are growing is your own understanding.

---

Danny, if you want the math to compute any horizontal or vertical slice of a sphere, I will provide, its not that bad.

D

[dray]

Thx Dana but right now if I take one more thing in my head I think I may forget my name.

Im working on a battery box for my e-bike business, getting ready for a China trip, cleaning my shop for inspection, juggling 2 businesses and my brain is spread thin.

[dray]

TO cut the shelves:

1. resize until the notches are slightly over the thickness of your wood.

2. There are two extra middle pieces, delete them they are the largest ones. You only need 2, one with notches on flat, one with notches on radius.

3. Hand nest, flip etc to get it all into your scrap wood.

4. Have Diego zero the machine, get a cup of coffee

5. cut

=P

[kirkkelsey]

I have created the design for the spherical shelves in Alibre Design and made it parametric to allow resizing.

The material is currently .771" thick, but that can be resized to suit. I have a nesting for a 4'x 8' sheet of material.

Anyone interest in cutting this design for personal use can send me an email via the forum.






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[mitch_prest]

G'day Kirk

I'd like a copy of that file... just what I was looking for .. for the daughters room

mitch

[dray]

Kirk, can you re size it small enough to upload to the forum here.

[kirkkelsey]

Danny,

Sorry the project zipped is greater than the 50k the posting will allow.

The project has been output for .750" material, but can be output for any other thickness. Email me with your material thickness dimension and I can output it for your material. Or download the free Alibre Design software www.alibre.com (http://www.alibre.com) and open the project and change the parameter MATERIAL_THICK to match the thickness of your material. Open the Drawing and then Export a new DXF file with your material thickness.

I just finished the model this morning and have not produced it yet. You will need to square the bottom of the slots to make it fit as I just ran them to the center of the piece.

The shelf is sized so that the nesting fits on a single sheet of 4x8 material (47.5" x 95.5" with 1/4" waste all round). It is just over 61" across. I am currently working on a nesting for a version that can be manufactured on a 4x4' ShopBot for Theresa.

[therechris]

Kirk,I read your post and you are very generous to spend your time on this.

[mitch_prest]

thanks Kirk

got the email and the DXF is great.. I can make any changes I need from there.. might try and run one after the weekend...

mitch

[paul_n]

Hi Kirk....
I'm also interested in looking at your file.
Please forward a copy.

Thanks
Paul

[pappybaynes]

Kirk,
I am interested also in looking at your file.
Thanks,
Dick

[zorlack]

Kirk,

Does Alibre do the toolpathing as well as the design? What does your work-flow look like using Alibre?

-Dave

[mitch_prest]

heres something that might help with the assembly..
\newurl{http://www.untothislast.co.uk/Shelving/CD%20Racks.html,http://www.untothislast.co.uk/Shelving/CD%20Racks.html}

[kirkkelsey]

Alibre Design is an affordable parametric CAD program, with a free version with limited part count. It is very similar to SolidWorks.

You model a "part" by drawing an outline and then you create a solid, in this case with extrusion. You have dimensions and constraints to define the lines and tell them where to be located.

You create an assembly from the Parts, and then can create drawings from the assembly. I created an assembly for the nesting, and created the drawing of the nesting for output to a DXF file.

You can toolpath in Alibre, but the software is designed more for metalworking and not as affordable as the design portion of the software. I prefer just to output a DXF file or layered DXF file and toolpath it in VCarve/PartWorks or MasterCAM.

I am glad the design was so well received as I put the shelves design together because the design intrigued me. Thought I would share it as it was a spec piece and only took a couple of hours (including nesting).

[kirkkelsey]

To use the Alibre model:

1. Open the SphereShelves.AD_PRT Part file and go into the Equation Editor using the f(x) icon on the right side, or Ctrl+E.

2. Modify the MATERIAL_THICK parameter to suit the thickness of the material you are using. Click OK to close the Equation Editor and then save and close the Alibre Part file.

3. Open the SphereShelves Nesting.AD_DRW drawing and FILE > EXPORT to save an AutoCAD (Rev14?) DXF file for toolpathing in the software of your choice.

4. If you are using PartWorks, you may need to JOIN open vectors.

Had I know there was so much interest in this project I would have spent a little more time on the model. The model can change the material thickness quite easily, but it is a little harder to change the overall size. You will need more than the free version of the software, and need to Suppress the individual parts while resizing the model itself. However, the free version of Alibre should allow you to output a DXF with the custom material thicknesses. I had to make the shelves a bit shallower than I would have liked to get the nesting to fit all on one 4x8 sheet.

I would be interested in feedback on the design as I just whipped it out in a few hours and have not had time to have it manufactured (that is to make sure it really works). Enjoy.

[bill.young]

Hi guys,

We're pretty excited that our newest column on the ShopBot website will be from Kirk on using Alibre to design for the ShopBot. Unfortunately as usual I'm the bottleneck for getting them posted, but as soon as I get settled in in Austin I'll work on getting Kirk's (and some new ones from Gary Campbell) posted.

Bill

[n9nun]

Kirk,

I would also be interested in the dxf file. This shelf would be great in the kid's room.

Mike

[henrik_o]

Just so we're clear here, is this a design that is in the public domain?

[drodda]

Here we go again? Did we not highjack a good thread on the Economy with this same IP issue?

What is there to be clear about? If you want to cut this file to put in your daughter's room for a shelf, I don't think anyone is going to care. However if you plan on setting up shop to sell these by the hundreds then you had better do your due diligence. The fact that there are many companies producing this shelf in many different stores, I would venture to say it is open to Public Domain discussion.

Seems to me a bunch of shopbot members discussing more than one way to skin a cat. There is no conspiracy to steal anyones IP here from what I am reading?

[henrik_o]

quote:What is there to be clear about?

The issue is not the discussion over design or whether someone cuts a copy to hang on their own personal wall.

The issue is that in this thread there are at least two design files offered with direct download links: these user-uploaded files are afaik hosted by Shopbot Inc, since they host the forum. Through no fault of itself, shopbot inc could as such be implicated in some form of rights infringement.

Now, I don't think this specific design is owned by anyone: I haven't seen any such notices in any case. And even if it is, realistically speaking nothing is going to happen anyway, no one is going to bother about some cnc enthusiasts reverse engineering a design.

But, if IP is treated cavalierly by us in this forum, there might come a day when someone decides to bother. At that point, Shopbot will have to decide what to do about the forum. Keep it open but disallow file sharing? Or close it down from their end, so that there's no formal ties between shopbot as a company and the forum?

[erik_f]

so you mean I shouldn't have just made and sold 10,000 of these to Wal-mart?

[dray]

A round watermelon can take up a lot of room in a refrigerator, and the usually round fruit often sits awkwardly on refrigerator shelves. Smart Japanese farmers have forced their watermelons to grow into a square shape by inserting the melons into square, tempered glass cases while the fruit is still growing on the vine.

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[gpari]

Danny's lost it


My grandfather was trying to grow square tomatoes in the 70's (as were countless others, I'm sure)

[drodda]

I would like to assume the sky is still intact, until we see pieces falling. Why highjack threads with what if's?

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[kirkkelsey]

There has been so much interest in this shelf design that I went back and re-created it from scratch with all the mathematical formulas, rather than a graphical solution.

The design now has the ability to display up to 4 additional shelf elements beside the center shelf, with an option for 3 or 2 side shelf elements instead. Open the Spherical Shelf4 / 3 / or 2, depending on the shelf construction. I quit at an additional 4 side shelf elements as the shelf dimension for the largest shelf exceeded 96" at this point.

To use this design, download and install the free Xpress version of Alibre Design.

1. Open the “spherical shelves.AD_PRT” Alibre Part file and modify the CAPITALIZED variables to suit desired shelf configuration. Sometimes it takes a little experimentation to get the shelf configured the way you want it. Open the Equation Editor using the f(x) icon on the far right; TOOLS > EQUATION EDITOR; or Ctrl+E.
SPHERE_RADIUS