Woodgrain texture bit

[brucehiggins]

Have any of you tried using a pointed roundover bit for carving woodgrain texture? I am working on a way to generate woodgrain vector lines that gradually spread apart and then gradually get closer together like slab cut wood. I wonder if a pointed roundover might give a better result than a vbit or bullnose as the grain lines spread apart. I will probably order one unless I get convinced it's a bad idea.

[joe]

Bruce,

One consideration when trying to make a woodgrain background with either round over or V bits is the edge affect around borders or letters. You can't get very close without digging in.

When trying to duplicate natures vertical movements it's necessary to give some kind of realistic z variation. Otherwise it's going to look fake.

Over the years I've made line drawings galor with varying widths in hopes of duplicating mother natures process. I know what a beautiful sandblasted grain is supposed to look like. So far there's not been any substitute for the real product.

The best imitation, so far, is a jpg of sandblasted wood and imported into ArtCam. It's good to keep in mind, a texture 3D file, can run very fast since there isn't an exacting detail record. The stepover can also be rather loose. It can really zip right along.

After posting on this subject for years, it seems most SBers have very little first hand experience with grained wood. Varying and irregular lines looks just like what it is.

Good luck with this endeavor. I'm rooting for you.

[brucehiggins]

Thanks Joe. I agree completely that there is no substitute for the real thing. I am aiming for an interesting looking background that has a natural, if not authentic, look. By that I mean it has a kind of random pleasing look that has some general rules but infinate variation within the rules. Mother nature does that with windblown sand, leaves, wood grain, etc. A lot of synthetic wood products now have great woodgrain texture but you know they are exact copies and limited variations so you may pick up 2 pieces that have the identical pattern. Takes away the awe even though it is a replica of a nice piece of wood.
Just by adding a somewhat random vertical movement to fake grain lines helps a lot. I think it is worth exploring some rules regarding proximity and variation between adjacent lines, patterns of vertical height with a degree of randomness instead of just random height changes, etc.. If there was only a government grant to fund research...

[tuck]

Hey guys, here is a website of an HDU sign wholesaler near me: http://www.hdusigns.com/index.html

Of interest, click on "Examples" and then click on the two pics on the bottom row that have a grain pattern background. I don't know how they do it but it looks pretty good for routed, doesn't it?

"From $16.00 a sq. ft."??? How do they do that too?

[evan]

The key word here is "From"

[brucehiggins]

The one with the blue letters is really nice. I wonder what their trick is.

[tuck]

I don't know WHAT their trick is, Bruce, but surely somebody in here is smart enough to figure it out. (It ain't me!)

[tuck]

I was experimenting today in the shop. I can't figure out a way to do it without resorting to pocket letters. The pics in the website I posted don't LOOK like pocket letters, but they could be. They could be indeed.

[wendell]

I agree the key word is "from".

[joe]

Mark,

Have you ruled out a 3D wood texture?

The cutting time isn't that long if you think the process through. Here's a couple of time savers.

Lets say we have a 2'X6' HDU panel with decorations and copy. I'd make an area clear down about 1/4", using a 1/4" bit with very little if any stepover. Copy's left standing. No sence in running this step slow. Let her rip. Then I'd put a 1/8" ballnose in for the woodgrain. The grain depth is only about 3/16" deep. Yep that's all it needs to be. Much deeper doesn't give a better affect. Since this is a very shallow cut, you can run a top speed.

I have a couple of these to do next week and I may run a time test on them, if anyone is interested.

I've spend lots of time and effort sandblasting boards to get my special affects. If your aren't as pickey, there are lots of woodgrain patterns available on the web. Or just take your digital camera and snap a few pictures yourself.

[brucehiggins]

Joe,
What software do you use to convert the picture to 3D toolpath?
Bruce

[tuck]

Hey Joe

To be honest, a simulated wood grain background is not something I have had had much demand for over the years. Maybe that's because it's not something that I have offered? Haha. ;-)

Having become more active in here again recently and seeing the idea mulled over as much as it has been (and I know it has been in the past), the problem intrigues me. To get it right and consistently beautiful without having to reinvent the wheel every time one designs a sign may be the final frontier in routed CNC sign making, I don't know. To me, it doesn't have to look exactly like sandblasted wood. It just needs to look very, very good and unique.

When you do those couple of signs next week, Joe, please post pics as well as run times. Of course we are all very interested!

Bruce, I see you have your website up and running and good for you! I'm having some problems figuring out how to download/save the utility/files using Firefox, but I'm not worried about that right now. The fact is, I happen to be out of any sizeable scrap HDU at the time so I have nothing to run test on at this moment anyway. If it works even halfway decent, it'll be well worth $20.00. Twenty bucks? Are you kiddin'? When all is said and done and if'n I STILL can't figure it out, I'll call you.

An interesting problem that brilliant minds in here are working on. It don't get much better than that, y'all!

[joe]

Bruce,

I'm not sure, but isn't there a 3D woodgrain file ready to go with V Carve or one of those programs? That way you could download the Machinests, free, and go to town.

I purchased ArtCam from my local dealer, www.beckwithdecor.com (http://www.beckwithdecor.com). If you aren't producing enough work to justify ArtCam, you could have the files made for you.

Mark.

If I sent you my sample panels to show to prospective clients, you'd be doing woodgrains, textures, and 3D work. I truly believe you have to show customers samples. Samples sell work.

I feel sorry for clients who need to order a sign for the first time. They don't know the possabilities, costs, production time. It's gotta be hard for them. I try to make it as easy as pobbilbe. It's easy and fun to make up some finished letters, mounted on a nice background, along with some nice shapes showing your skills. You can really enlarge and build a business this way. Show em what you can really do. For years I had a little portfolio. It was better than nothing but not nearly as effective as the real poduct.

Often I have clients who want some letters. No problem, I then suggest making them with an outline or drop shade for a little extra cost. I love doing this from 1/4" PVC or DiBond. I also offer texturing and or Sculpt Nouveau. Good samples of my work, often makes those plain old letters they had in mind not to attractive,

Sample, Samples, Samples

Joe

[tuck]

Joe,

You are quite right: Samples Samples Samples! You can show a customer pictures and talk till you're blue in the face, but if a picture is worth a thousand words, a sample in worth a million!

I'm fixin' to drop some money to do a wide variety of samples,...not just for me to have but for the other sign shops I do CNC work for. Often times when I'm trying to explain to them about the different ways to skin the same cat, they just don't seem to get it. Samples screwed to their walls should solve that problem!

And I think you're right about another thing - I believe V Carve Pro does offer a 3D woodgrain file ready to go. I think I have V Carve somewhere,...LOL! I know I have ArtCam Pro and have never used it, along with Illustrator, Photoshop, Flexisign and a few others. I've been stuck in SignLab 5 for so long, I guess it's time I broadened my horizons!

You da man Joe, a true heavyweight in the sign making business. Your last name should be 'Frazier'!