Probe Problems-(Continued)

[myxpykalix]

Talked to scott today, (couldn't call back after 5pm) so i need advice from the 3-11 shift of experts here!

I'm using the beta control software 3.5b22. I went thru the loading of firmware. It recognizes probe. We set up a test probe with these parameters (pictured below)

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Now my understanding is the probe should move in the X axis till the side of the probe contacts the object. It should stop, raise up, lower and start probing the object, right?
This starts moving in the X axis contacts the object and continues in the X without raising up and if i were not holding the object and moved it, it would drag the probe across the surface till it broke (again). Also the stepovers seemed like they were about 1/8" at a time and not 1000th which would be a tiny movement.This is the same behavior as before. This feels like a software issue to me.."But what do i know, i'm just the 800 pound Gorilla in the room". Anybody with a probe that is successful can give advice? THANKS

[bill.young]

The first thing I'd suggest is to make sure that the probe is connected and working correctly.

When the probe tip contacts the blank (or when you move the tip of the probe with your finger), does the #1 input indicator light go off in the red panel control panel, and come back on when you release it?

[Brady Watson]

I've always had good luck with this version of the probe file. It ran well on my PRT in SB3, I have not tried it on the Alpha since I rarely do 2D scans, and 3D is done on a dedicated laser machine.

Be sure to enter in the correct parameters.

-B


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[myxpykalix]

Hi bill, brady..the probe is connectly correctly. The red light is on underneath the probe, when you touch the probe the light on the probe turns green, then back to red. However the #1 light on the control panel is on and green but does not change upon contact of the probe. The Z never moves up and down when you do a probe. It starts out and moves up about 3/4", goes back down, moves in the x axis, side of probe contacts surface, it continues in the X axis, does not raise up but would continue to drag across surface. Sounds to me like it is continuing in the X as if it is looking for the edge to start and the probe is not getting that info back to the software.

I know nothing about the movement strategy of this thing but the movements suggest that the X and Y parameters are set (by virtue of what you set) and independent of the probe and the probe only maps out the topographical features of the piece correct? That might explain why its not moving in the Z axis, as the signal is not getting back to the software. Am i on the right track here?

[Brady Watson]

Did you try the old tried and true S_prb3d2.sbp I posted? The new probe routines are different than this one (pretty sure).

-B

[myxpykalix]

headed out to the shop now to do that...thanks will report results.

[myxpykalix]

Well by tomorrow I will regret this rant but as they say "OH, WELL"!!

MY probe Broke AGAIN. Shopbot You really need to provide complete comprehensive instructions with these parts or stop selling them! Clearly there are software issues and problems that need to be fixed. I've had this thing 6 months and haven't been able to probe one part. Man, this is frustrating!!!
----------------rant off...........

Brady I used your sbp file, had it over my indexer bay in an area i thought was safe and it acted like it was going to a 0,0 point and hit the table breaking the probe off at the threaded part. I don't know what happened. But thank you for helping me.

[dray]

Thats why I dont think I'm gonna buy a probe or indexer.. At least not until there some sort of instructions

[bill.young]

John,

Sounds like this is a little late...guess I should have stayed up later (or you should have gone to sleep earlier).

"However the #1 light on the control panel is on and green but does not change upon contact of the probe."

The led light on the body of the probe only tells you if the internal switch in the probe is working, NOT if it's connected and communicating correctly with the input switch in the control box. The real test of any kind of input switch connection are the input switch indicators in the red control panel. With a probe, if the indicator light on the control panel doesn't turn off when the tip makes contact with either the blank or your finger, and back on when you release it, the control box and the software don't know when the switch has been triggered. Since the indicator doesn't go off on your tool when you move the tip, that problem has to be fixed before you can do anything with the probe, no matter what software you use.

It could be a connection or internal problem with the probe itself, but since by default the Z-zero plate and the probe are connected to the same input connection one simple possibility is that your Z-zero plate is making contact with the body of tool when you're not using it and therefore with ground, keeping the circuit completed so that the probe can't break the circuit and turn off the input switch. With your Z-zero plate in it's normal, resting position, is the #1 indicator in the red panel on when the probe is unplugged?

Bill

[Towersonline]

Jack, As they say "I feel your pain" I too experienced your exact problems with the probe. There were actually two problems one was as Bill described. The second was that the wiring diagram provided was incorrect. I eventually worked out the issues. You are correct the documentation is poor. I even called ShopBot and offered to write a manual for it... no one ever called back. I got so mad about this I tossed the probe in the trash. I'll pay someone to do scans the next time. Maybe Ted will kick some butt and get it done. SO THATS MY RANT

[gpari]

Next time someone is going to throw away their probe, let me know. I'll take it off your hands


Gabe "Instructions, we don't need no stinkin' instructions" Pari
www.socalteardrops.com (http://www.socalteardrops.com)

[myxpykalix]

Does anyone know when you start a scan whether you start the scan with the probe outside the perimeter of the object and at/or below surface height to be probed or above the corner of the object?
The problem i'm having now is that the probe senses the top surface plunges down touches once, then acts as if it is stuck and the machine goes into some type of "safety routine" jiggling in N,S,E,W like it is trying to unstick the probe then it defaults out and stops saying "probe routine stopped, stuck" (or something like that)
and the tip is on a flat surface from the initial surface "feel" to tell it where surface is. I'm just trying to scan a 2"x4" side of a pencil holder with a shallow leaf pattern that is no more than 1/16" deep from surface so i don't think it could get stuck in any deep crevace.

[Brady Watson]

It does the jiggling routine because it is trying to re-establish communication with the box. I bet your wiring is not right. Try swaping the 2 wires that are not connected to 5v+. (Input 1 & Gnd) THEN see if input 1 is on when you have the probe plugged in. If it is, wiggle the stylus, it should go off. Release the probe, back on again. If NOT you either have a broken wire or it is hooked up incorrectly. Inspect & test the wiring.

-B

[myxpykalix]

In talking to scott we figured out that the connector at the Z zero plate was wired incorrectly from shopbot to begin with. So after changing that, the #1 button would blink when you touch probe. The lights underneath would go from red to green so i think that it is wired up correctly at this point. I had to take the probe apart to try to get the broken stem out of the unit. After putting it back together it doesn't seem to want to work. When I worked with scott while it was just a nub sticking out I think it started to work. I guess when i put it back together its not right however its just a contact point switch, i guess maybe a schematic or diagram or wiring diagram would have solved all these problems and maybe stopped them from occurring in the first place. It's one of those things that make you go....Hmmmmm.

[bill.young]

John,

The "wiggle" is done when the probe contacts the surface of the blank and turns off, but doesn't turn back on when it lifts off of the surface like it should. It lifts all the way to the top..the "Safe Z-axis Clearance" setting from the Copy Machine fillin...and it's registering that it's still making contact.

Some of the earliest probes would occasionally catch when they made contact and that wiggle would shake it loose, but it's generally an indication of an internal problem with the probe. Maybe something is shifting inside and keeping the probe contacts from making contact again?

Bill

[bill.young]

John,

"Does anyone know when you start a scan whether you start the scan with the probe outside the perimeter of the object and at/or below surface height to be probed or above the corner of the object? "

The answer is up to you and depends on how much of the blank you want to probe. You can start outside the perimeter if you want to copy the edges of the piece, or start on the corner if you just want to do it's "top face". Sometimes you may want to do a small part of a big blank...in that case set the X and Y scan pattern size settings to cover the area that you want to copy. When it asks you if you want to use the Keypad to move to the start point, move to that starting point and you're ready to go.

The first move that the Copy Machine makes is a lift to the "Safe Z-axis Clearance" value that you entered in the fillin sheet so it doesn't matter where the Z-axis is when you start the Copy Machine. If you set the "Maximum Probing Depth" so that the probe tip will touch the table surface then it will record points on the table top surface that are outside the blank and the bottom of holes in the blank. If you set that value so that it's above the table surface then it will only record the places where it contacts the blank and not any points on the table top.

Bill

[myxpykalix]

Here is the results of probing a 2"x4" side of a pencil box with a leaf pattern that was less than 1/8th" deep at its deepest point.
The Y and X stepovers were at .1 and i was using the middle sized probe extension (smallest broke).
It took 3 hours to do this.



8744 (13.9 k)
Here is what it looks like

8745
But if you look at the results its horrible. The problem, I assume, is twofold. I had a larger stepover should have been smaller, and the probe was too big. I knew it was going to be bad because of those things. When i get the replacement smaller probe attachment i'll try again.

[dingenis]

hi,
probing problem here as well, but it looks quite different.
running a prt 4g upgrade controlvers 4.3.
3D probing works fine but 2D probing does not work.
during probing 2D computer(sb control) freezes and can only be shut down> using ctrl alt delete.
The computer freezes when the probe makes contact during the first CC command.(somewhere line 81-83 in the vtprobing file).
At this point it should go to the subroutine, but it does not.
I have tested this also on other inputs and with different switches, result GOSUB ANYWHERE during CC command > shopbot control freezes on input change.I did reinstall SB several times._same result.
any suggestions?

thanks